Inflation be Damned

[Gadianton]

As I've said before, if Ajax really believes that the party of whoever is president determines the economy, he'd put his money where his mouth is and reap millions in investment profits. He has no faith whatsoever in his position. He just feels better getting it off his chest and blaming his perceived opposition for all of his problems.

[Physics Guy]

Gasoline prices in Germany are equivalent to nearly $8/gallon. (About 1.80€/Liter, @ 1.09 USD/EUR and 3.8 L/gal.) This is up a bit but not drastically more than it has been for many years. Gasoline is heavily taxed in most of Europe. It's kind of like how alcohol is in the US.

Farmers still run tractors. They're probably more careful not to run them when they don't have to than they would be if gas were four times cheaper.

[ajax18]

Gasoline prices in Germany are equivalent to nearly $8/gallon. (About 1.80€/Liter, @ 1.09 USD/EUR and 3.8 L/gal.) This is up a bit but not drastically more than it has been for many years. Gasoline is heavily taxed in most of Europe. It's kind of like how alcohol is in the US.

And how much further along is Europe in green energy technology than the US is? Perhaps if western Europe didn't have such a radical position on green energy, they wouldn't have found themselves dependent on Russian oil as they are now? Perhaps they wouldn't have had to appease Putin all these years out of fear of being cut off from his fossil fuels. This Russian invasion is finally starting to wake them up a bit to the idea of investing in their military and national defense again.

Farmers still run tractors. They're probably more careful not to run them when they don't have to than they would be if gas were four times cheaper.

I doubt German farmers are very competitive. But your point is basically that western countries should bear almost all the economic costs of green energy since they can afford it. Keep in mind it's not the 1% uber rich paying this but middle and lower class families driving to work, picking up kids at school, and buying their groceries. Gasoline (and by extension everything) is expensive in western countries and it should be because this is somehow going to save the planet, right?

[canpakes]

Gasoline (and by extension everything) is expensive in western countries and it should be because this is somehow going to save the planet, right?

No, gasoline is expensive because it’s a commodity and it costs money to create. Contrary to the beliefs of many conservatives, it doesn’t just squirt out of the earth’s gooey core of petroleum, ready to use by people with a weird sense of entitlement.

[K Graham]

Gasoline prices in Germany are equivalent to nearly $8/gallon. (About 1.80€/Liter, @ 1.09 USD/EUR and 3.8 L/gal.) This is up a bit but not drastically more than it has been for many years. Gasoline is heavily taxed in most of Europe. It's kind of like how alcohol is in the US.

Farmers still run tractors. They're probably more careful not to run them when they don't have to than they would be if gas were four times cheaper.

Very true, but in Europe, transportation options are plentiful. Thanks to idiots in Right Wing 'Merica, we're too far behind the rest of the developed world in terms of accessible public transportation. And then they want to whine about gas prices every time a war happens.

Madrid's subway/train system was just amazing when I was there on my mission 30 years ago. I can only assume it has improved over time. When I was there last year we didn't hit the subway but I noticed there were electric scooters everywhere for rent. That and electric bikes are the new thing in Europe.

China, France, Italy and Japan all have bullet trains that go over 300 MPH.

[Physics Guy]

Public transportation in Boston was supposed to be good by American standards and it did indeed work well to get around the city without a car. The buses and trams were all old and beat-up, though. Europe is different in that way. It turns out that Mercedes-Benz makes buses. That's not just a metaphor. You see them a lot. Trains are fancy as well.

It's partly because distances between major population centers are much shorter in Europe. Population density is high here. It's not mostly in mega-cities, but in an awful lot of middle-sized cities that are quite close together, or in long stretches with another small town every couple of miles. There's not a lot of country in the old country.

That makes public transportation a lot easier to fund because you have much less infrastructure to support for a given user base. And it's a self-reinforcing effect. Once the trains are fast and good and frequent enough, more people use them and it becomes easier to fund them well enough to keep them fast and frequent and good.

[K Graham]

And how much further along is Europe in green energy technology than the US is?

40% of energy in the EU comes from renewables, compared to just 20% for the USA. Europe is far more dense in population than North America. Nearly twice as dense.

Perhaps if western Europe didn't have such a radical position on green energy, they wouldn't have found themselves dependent on Russian oil as they are now?

You've gone from incorrectly whining about the absence of "Russian oil" costing Americans, to now pretending like you care if Europeans pay more by blocking Russian oil. If they're willing to make that sacrifice, it is up to them. Why does it piss you off so much? Because doing so would prove Biden's leadership via sanctions would prove economically devastating to Putin? Yeah, that's what I thought.

If you thought the selling of heroin to 4 year kids could somehow hurt Democrats, you'd be all for it. But maybe not, if we were talking about only white kids.

Perhaps they wouldn't have had to appease Putin all these years out of fear of being cut off from his fossil fuels.

Are you [personal attack deleted] that you think Putin is feeling "appeased" by the West? He's been bitching and moaning about it for years now. If Europe wanted to appease Russia the way Trump did, they'd all be in favor of dismantling NATO and they wouldn't be pursuing military bases closer to Russia's border?

This Russian invasion is finally starting to wake them up a bit to the idea of investing in their military and national defense again.

And they're doing what we're too damned stupid to do, by moving towards green energy full steam ahead. The problem is there isn't really enough sunlight at that latitude to provide enough energy for the nearly 800 million people living in Europe. Which is why they're pursuing other ideas, like a solar grid built in the deserts of North Africa to connect to the EU.

Keep in mind it's not the 1% uber rich paying this but middle and lower class families driving to work, picking up kids at school, and buying their groceries.

And they'd be spending far more than that if we engaged Russia militarily like so many idiot Republicans are calling for. Stop pretending the world owes you $2 gasoline, and stop pretending you give a rats arse about how much working Americans spend. You hate most of them anyway since they don't support Trump.

Gasoline (and by extension everything) is expensive in western countries and it should be because this is somehow going to save the planet, right?

Absolutely. You don't really understand much when it comes to science or economics. When the cost of anything becomes too high, people will seek other goods and services. Democrats have been telling us for years that dependence on oil risks us in terms of National Security. But Republicans are bought by fossil fuel companies, and don't really mind kicking the can down the road if it means more money in their pockets and another election win because of all the campaign funding they received from Big Oil.

[ajax18]

Gas was going up well before this war started. This war is becoming the scape goat for Biden's failed economic and energy policies. It might even help them keep working class votes they wete going to lose. I thought using Covid to push through cheat by mail was genius. If this war wins Dems control in 2022, that may even top the scamdemic.

[canpakes]

Gas was going up well before this war started. This war is becoming the scape goat for Biden's failed economic and energy policies.

Please point to those policies and how they have failed to keep gas cheap enough for your liking.

[K Graham]

Gas was going up well before this war started.

It actually went up and then began to come down right before the war. It was going up because of Biden's robust recovery. Again, you don't understand supply and demand. I asked this question many months ago and you wouldn't answer. Would you rather have gas at $2.60 (Trump's avg) when there are millions out of work, thousands of businesses closed down, travel plans for millions canceled, etc.... or would you rather have a robust economy where 8 million more Americans are working, wages are reaching record highs, and gasoline is going up $.80 because of all the high demand that comes with a booming economy?

This war is becoming the scape goat for Biden's failed economic and energy policies.

What policies have failed? None. You're just pitching a fit because the greatest economic expansion in forty plus years is happening with "sleepy Joe" at the wheel and you don't know how to handle it other than to spew idiotic talking points from Brietbart.

I thought using Covid to push through cheat by mail was genius.

Ah, so Republicans loved mail in voting prior to COVID, but it only became "cheat by mail" when they realized more Americans voted Blue, so they needed a scapegoat.

With respect to gasoline, here are the hard facts:

1. From June 2014 to February 2016, the last two years of the Obama administration, avg gasoline prices dropped in half from $3.75 to $1.87. I don't remember anyone claiming it was Obama's policies.

2. When Trump took office gasoline was at $2.30 and it rose to $2.97 by June 2018. That's over 30% inflation over his first 18 months in office. And if you adjust for inflation, $2.97 in 2018 is equivalent to $3.32 in 2022. Which means we're only slightly higher now than we were 3.5 years ago when none of you idiots were complaining about gas prices because Trump was in office.

If any Democrat had been whining about gas prices and blaming Trump I would have called them idiots, but I didn't see any of that because stupidity and excuse making is something Republicans claim for themselves.