RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

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Binger
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by Binger »

Gunnar wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 12:10 am
Binger wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 10:44 pm


That is one way to look at it. Another way to consider it is that these are not the conditions I would choose. So, rather than confront them, I am opting out. I know many others that have a similar response. Life is short. There is much to do. Fixing an election process that allows people to mail in a ballot, laughing out loud, ain't on their priority list. It certainly ain't on mine.

If you disagree with me, you ain't wrong. And the fact that the process meets your standards is just limited to you. It doesn't meet my standards, and I do not find the process credible.
But you still haven't shown nor do I think you can show any compelling evidence that voting by mail is inherently fraudulent or cannot be made acceptably secure.
Yes. I have shown it. I said - it does not meet my standards, so I am out. If the places I live want it, great. Have it without me. The end.

Other than that. Voting by mail has a chain of custody that I do not accept for voting. Also the end.
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Gadianton
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by Gadianton »

Well finally enough to identify the concern.

https://www.theintell.com/story/opinion ... 228835001/
honorentheos
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by honorentheos »

Gadianton wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 2:22 am
Well finally enough to identify the concern.

https://www.theintell.com/story/opinion ... 228835001/
Therefore, the election officials have no way of determining:

1.) That the person who requested the ballot was actually the voter;

2.) That the person to whom the ballot was addressed actually voted, and not someone else;

3.) That the vote was confidential, and not coerced in any way;

4.) That no ballot harvesting or other similar schemes were conducted;

5.) That the ballot was not tampered with upon leaving the possession of the voter.


Are these the concerns that led Culty to stop participating in elections? Care to confirm, Cultellus?

Actually, Gad, I'd like to get your take. You said elsewhere you don't normally participate in voting, either. You with Cultellus here?
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canpakes
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

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I’m left wondering about the sort of effort required to intercept and fraudulently alter any significant part of 2.6 million ballots-by-mail, all while preventing any of the folks who were supposed to receive them - but didn’t - from either reporting having not received them, or having voted in person later, when a double vote would have been discovered.

Or am I missing something?
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Gadianton
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

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The bottom line for me, h, is that I'm just naturally not much of a participator and kind of an outsider. If I weren't married and laden with responsibilities, and with a career firmly remote at this point, I'd live out in the middle of nowhere in like, one of these small ranches and fix up the place and stay away from people most of the time.

I've never paid much attention to politics, figuring that anything I'm dissatisfied in life about can be fixed far more directly by other means rather than by voting. I've never liked the personality types in politics because the job seems to require a certain level of charlatanism to succeed. Also, I've never really felt like there would be much difference between presidential candidates. I abhor listening to speeches. I can't stand all the "ra ra ra" Amway convention BS in politics. I don't want to go to an event and feel all the energy behind a candidates platform and get excited about it. I don't like religion, and politics is very similar to religion.

My biggest exposure to politics was probably EA, since we'd been friends since Z and he was really into politics, and I enjoyed getting his take on things. Since then I've enjoyed you others who have cropped up since EA chickened out and left. EA convinced me that Hilary would be better than Trump. But not enough to actually vote. My little exposure to political science in school did convince me of the importance of gridlock, and if anything, I'd get concerned about a president with too much ability to get things done. I figured Hilary with all her connections and experience would get a crapload done, and getting things done means changing the nature of the game you have to play as a citizen. I figured Trump was too much of an idiot to accomplish anything, and so maybe he'd be better. Boy, was I wrong. Trump "accomplished" way more than I could ever imagine, and most of it bad.

Binger is wrong about one thing. While my counterfactual votes up to 2020 wouldn't have counted for much, in 2020, I was living in a swing state, and I'm proud to say that I voted, and my vote kept Ajax's president out of office :lol: . This time, there is no question that the president makes a difference. I really hope we can go back to my vote not being needed. You guys can hammer out the little stuff, I just want the basics in place, which are now at risk, thanks to right-wing fanaticism. Unfortunately, I fear I will need to vote in future elections.

I don't know all the voting distinctions, I voted with a ballot that came to me in the mail, but I didn't mail it, I dropped it off at the voting tent. The thought did occur to me that a right-wing mailperson would have no problem dumping my ballot so I dropped it off to be sure. So did all the right-wingers on my walk, none of them voted in person.

I have no reason to believe that voting by mail isn't safe enough when considering the large number of voters. I read all the articles that subs would post about voting fraud and a lot of it comes down to (the stuff with any merit at all) people not understanding things like how information systems work, bugs in code, and so on, that aren't critical. A city's IT budget isn't the same as Google's.

I've said before that I don't like the fact that Democrats have to rely on mail-in voting because so many poor people don't have bank accounts or proper ID, and therefore can't vote otherwise. How about a concerted effort to help poor people get proper ID, and so on, which will help them in far more direct ways than being able to vote? That also helps with jobs and other benefits. But, things can always be worse, so if the only way to keep unhinged right-wingers out of office is to have poor people mail in their ballots, then so be it.
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by honorentheos »

Thanks, Gad. I get the impulse towards cynicism and, honestly, it was probably only due to a few twigs in the river of my life that made me interested in politics in more than a sports team way. I have to credit (blame?) two influential professors and timing as much as anything. That, and the lead up to the Iraq war was personal, so its hard to be cynically detached in that circumstance I guess.

So, I guess its a tangent but I don't see it as such - what got you interested in philosophical positions and economics then? Both seem to be similarly tied to potentially "ra ra" games of Pokeman card flips, whose school trumps the other, etc.
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Some Schmo
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by Some Schmo »

canpakes wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 3:19 am
I’m left wondering about the sort of effort required to intercept and fraudulently alter any significant part of 2.6 million ballots-by-mail, all while preventing any of the folks who were supposed to receive them - but didn’t - from either reporting having not received them, or having voted in person later, when a double vote would have been discovered.

Or am I missing something?
You're missing the fact that people who whine about the electoral process for non-fact-based reasons are not serious about facts and are trying to shoehorn their personal wishes into the conversation; essentially, you're wondering about the idle thoughts of idiots.

My recommendation is to ignore the thoughts of idiots.
Religion is for people whose existential fear is greater than their common sense.
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canpakes
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by canpakes »

Some Schmo wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 5:41 am
My recommendation is to ignore the thoughts of idiots.

Good advice, and fitting for whatever the fellow below has to say, as well, including this bit from a few years back -
U.S. Rep. Steve King told the Westside Conservative Club on Wednesday that humanity might not exist if not for rape and incest.

"What if we went back through all the family trees and just pulled those people out that were products of rape and incest? Would there be any population of the world left if we did that?" he said at the event in Urbandale, Iowa.

"Considering all the wars and all the rapes and pillages taken place and whatever happened to culture after society? I know I can't certify that I'm not a part of a product of that."

The Kiron Republican was defending his position of not allowing exceptions for rape and incest in the anti-abortion legislation he tried to pass in Congress. Republican leadership had prevented the bills he sponsored on banning abortions from advancing through the House, despite GOP support for the measures, King said.
https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story ... apple-news
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Binger
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by Binger »

Gadianton wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 2:22 am
Well finally enough to identify the concern.

https://www.theintell.com/story/opinion ... 228835001/
That is a succinct description. And it is unclear whether the poster is left or right or indifferent. That is not the totality of my concerns, but those points are enough for me to check right on out and not play voter games with the other reindeers.
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Binger
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Re: RvW Overturned - Abortions Now Illegal

Post by Binger »

Gadianton wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 2:22 am
Well finally enough to identify the concern.

https://www.theintell.com/story/opinion ... 228835001/
Oh, by the way Gad. Nice find. I have to post twice. I can't do an ETA on my previous post. But yeah... nicely done.
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