What If? 2020

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honorentheos
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What If? 2020

Post by honorentheos »

Since taking office, the Biden administration has been hit by wave after wave of difficult issues. I'd grade their response as a "C" overall. Some they've handled well like the Russian buildup to invasion. Solid A. Afghanistan and inflation, D level work at best. The domestic agenda started out with momentum but disparity between views and too narrow a majority of support in the Senate threw that into reverse, and it seems likely Biden's term in office will be seen popularly as four years where no one really got what they wanted. When pollsters ask people if they are better off or worse off since Biden took office, the reality is far too many will lean negative.

But what if someone else had won in 2020? Suppose all the moderate Democrats hadn't conceded and thrown in with Biden to prevent Bernie Sanders from winning the Democratic nomination? Setting aside the potential for a brokered convention, say Sanders won. And let's say that Arizona still went Blue which I think would have been less likely, but preserves the one vote VP tie break for Dems in the Senate.

What would have gone differently?
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Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by Doctor CamNC4Me »

We would’ve had the most epic SOTU addresses, for sure. Bernie would’ve been up there pounding the pulpit more vigorously than a Southern Baptists convention speaker.

- Doc
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2. Every utterance has a winner or a loser.
3. Curiosity is feigned.
4. Lying is performative.
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Binger
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by Binger »

honorentheos wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:08 pm
Since taking office, the Biden administration has been hit by wave after wave of difficult issues. I'd grade their response as a "C" overall. Some they've handled well like the Russian buildup to invasion. Solid A. Afghanistan and inflation, D level work at best. The domestic agenda started out with momentum but disparity between views and too narrow a majority of support in the Senate threw that into reverse, and it seems likely Biden's term in office will be seen popularly as four years where no one really got what they wanted. When pollsters ask people if they are better off or worse off since Biden took office, the reality is far too many will lean negative.

But what if someone else had won in 2020? Suppose all the moderate Democrats hadn't conceded and thrown in with Biden to prevent Bernie Sanders from winning the Democratic nomination? Setting aside the potential for a brokered convention, say Sanders won. And let's say that Arizona still went Blue which I think would have been less likely, but preserves the one vote VP tie break for Dems in the Senate.

What would have gone differently?
Sanders would have been less polarizing, but equally ineffective.
Klobachar would have been shut down by the left.
Tulsi would have been a rock star, but the squad and the left would have undermined her.
Pete and the guy that ran for NY mayor are not leaders at all. Not even a little bit. They would have been great puppets though. Maybe the closest thing to Biden.
The most qualified Democrat in the primaries was a Republican.

Scores for Biden:
Ukraine: F- for being a complicit bucket carrying crony to a money-laundering crime syndicate
Afghanistan: F
Inflation - Actual: C (what the hell can he really do?)
Inflation - Media, Messaging: F
Crime: F
Global Warming: F (Coal plants are working in Eastern Europe. I can feel the sun more)
Media Matters (Baby Formula, Vaccines, Lockdowns, Gasoline): F, F, F, F
Wokebuttnesses: A+ ("I am not a biologist FTW)
International Affairs: A+ (Fistbumped a Crown Prince)
Surviving Cancer: A++
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Binger
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by Binger »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:30 pm
We would’ve had the most epic SOTU addresses, for sure. Bernie would’ve been up there pounding the pulpit more vigorously than a Southern Baptists convention speaker.

- Doc
Not only that, he would be speaking to the people and not to the Congress. His second-fourth SOTU addresses would have had more viewers than the Super Bowl.

Bernie was the last stand for Democrats relationship with labor. The dude is strange. The dude has a lot of passion and he is a leader. If we had three or more parties in this country, instead of just two, he would have been a massive player.
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Xenophon
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by Xenophon »

Interesting question, honor.

I'd start by saying that I'm pretty doubtful that had any of the other candidates been nominated that the result would have been the same. Far too close a race in some areas to suspect that a whole different candidate gets Dems there. I also think that putting an early end to in-fighting and focusing on non-primary messaging was critical to Biden's win. That said, that wasn't the question you asked.

I think in your scenario we have to imagine Sanders gets the nod as opposed to anyone else, he had the highest delegate count by far and I'm hard pressed to imagine another in the moderate wing of the party responding too terribly differently. To the domestic agenda, I doubt Sanders would have gotten much more than Biden has. Perhaps he is just the greatest statesman of all time but I'm not optimistic he'd be better at consolidating the party, especially given his "outsider" feel (fair or not). You've already highlighted the difficulties presented by how narrow the margin of victory was and that doesn't go away if you change the leader of the party.

You've presented some different strategies you'd have liked the Biden admin to take, namily breaking these huge bills into smaller, more easily managed, chunks on popular topics (infrastructure, child care, health care, family leave, etc.). I see the wisdom in that approach and its possible that would have been easier to get through, folks are way less likely to block a bill dedicated exclusively to a popular topic. I'm not sure if any other President would have tried that though, especially since that doesn't seem to be the direction Congress is moving.

The only area I suspect Sanders might have had notable impact would be on inflation. Not that the current result would have been different, just that I can easily see his admin being less tone deaf on the topic.
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Some Schmo
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by Some Schmo »

Instead of "Let's Go Brandon" it would have been "Let's Go Stenhouse." And oh, how the hilarity would ensue.
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Moksha
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by Moksha »

Binger would still have been as annoying as heck. I think Bernie would have led to four more years of Trump. Joe Biden spared us from four more years of Trump.
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honorentheos
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by honorentheos »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:30 pm
We would’ve had the most epic SOTU addresses, for sure. Bernie would’ve been up there pounding the pulpit more vigorously than a Southern Baptists convention speaker.

- Doc
Could be so. Probably less likely at the SotU than at White House press briefs but I concur with your point.
honorentheos
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by honorentheos »

Binger wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:34 pm
Sanders would have been less polarizing, but equally ineffective.
The milquetoast middle way holdout candidate is more polarizing than a self-proclaimed proud independent socialist (rebranded social democrat) would have been when socialism is the #1 Boogeyman of rightwing media? That's one way to set a tone for what a reader can expect will follow I guess.
Tulsi would have been a rock star, but the squad and the left would have undermined her.
Gabbard had one issue - no foreign wars. Joe Rogan podcast listeners were her only demographic, for good reason (know-it-all self-important burnouts, to be clear). She would have been a rock, alright...around the neck of the executive and Democrats. Putin couldn't have been happier had she won. Three bills she sponsered that passed into law in seven years, all related to veteran issues. She practically didn't show up for work at all in 2019 until COVID made her job the one thing she could do besides her Hindu cult duties and surf. Jeszis.
Scores for Biden:
Ukraine: F- for being a complicit bucket carrying crony to a money-laundering crime syndicate
Afghanistan: F
Inflation - Actual: C (what the hell can he really do?)
Inflation - Media, Messaging: F
Crime: F
Global Warming: F (Coal plants are working in Eastern Europe. I can feel the sun more)
Media Matters (Baby Formula, Vaccines, Lockdowns, Gasoline): F, F, F, F
Wokebuttnesses: A+ ("I am not a biologist FTW)
International Affairs: A+ (Fistbumped a Crown Prince)
Surviving Cancer: A++
Brnnt.
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Binger
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Re: What If? 2020

Post by Binger »

honorentheos wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:19 am
Binger wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:34 pm
Sanders would have been less polarizing, but equally ineffective.
The milquetoast middle way holdout candidate is more polarizing than a self-proclaimed proud independent socialist (rebranded social democrat) would have been when socialism is the #1 Boogeyman of rightwing media? That's one way to set a tone for what a reader can expect will follow I guess.
Tulsi would have been a rock star, but the squad and the left would have undermined her.
Gabbard had one issue - no foreign wars. Joe Rogan podcast listeners were her only demographic, for good reason (know-it-all self-important burnouts, to be clear). She would have been a rock, alright...around the neck of the executive and Democrats. Putin couldn't have been happier had she won. Three bills she sponsered that passed into law in seven years, all related to veteran issues. She practically didn't show up for work at all in 2019 until COVID made her job the one thing she could do besides her Hindu cult duties and surf. Jeszis.
Scores for Biden:
Ukraine: F- for being a complicit bucket carrying crony to a money-laundering crime syndicate
Afghanistan: F
Inflation - Actual: C (what the hell can he really do?)
Inflation - Media, Messaging: F
Crime: F
Global Warming: F (Coal plants are working in Eastern Europe. I can feel the sun more)
Media Matters (Baby Formula, Vaccines, Lockdowns, Gasoline): F, F, F, F
Wokebuttnesses: A+ ("I am not a biologist FTW)
International Affairs: A+ (Fistbumped a Crown Prince)
Surviving Cancer: A++
Brnnt.
Hindu Cult?
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