Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

The Off-Topic forum for anything non-LDS related, such as sports or politics. Rated PG through PG-13.
User avatar
Res Ipsa
God
Posts: 9568
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:44 pm
Location: Playing Rabbits

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Res Ipsa »

Chap wrote:
Wed Sep 07, 2022 8:19 pm
Vēritās wrote:
Wed Sep 07, 2022 2:22 am


The damage this has caused cannot be oversold. Why would any of our allies trust us to keep any of their national security related secrets secret after this fiasco? We've sent a message to the world that is very loud and clear:

"WE ARE NOW A COUNTRY THAT WILL ELECT AN ABSOLUTE MORON WHO WILL COMPROMISE YOUR MOST PRECIOUS SECRETS."

Moreover, if I'm a spy working overseas in a totalitarian state and reading the developments on this, knowing full well that a President may very well have highly classified docs in his desk at a country club detailing my exact whereabouts, then I'm sweating bullets and considering the cost benefit analysis of becoming a double agent.

The idea that we'd have a President so effin stupid that he'd declassify a massive trove of docs with a wave of his hand like this, is enough to send a chill up the spines of anyone who has ever worked in counter-intelligence.
This could be:

(a) About a NATO ally. That would be the UK or France, the only other two nuclear armed countries in that alliance apart from the US.

OR

(b) About a third country that might be a potential adversary.


It does not appear to be in dispute that Trump had indeed taken some extremely secret material to Mar-A-Lago. That's very bad for the US in any case. If that secret material included something falling under (a) or (b), it is a whole lot worse. We shall have to wait and see, shan't we?

Though in the interim, there will certainly be at least two countries telephoning the White House to say "OK. Level with us. We need to know: did Trump take stuff that directly bears on our national security? And don't give us that 'have to wait for the special master' stuff. Tell us now."
The judge's order applies only to the criminal investigation of Trump. There is no restriction on communicating with allies about potential security risks. I'd wager that's already happened and will continue to happen.
he/him
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.

Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
Vēritās
God
Posts: 1555
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2022 2:51 am

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Vēritās »

Bill Barr believes the DOJ will or should appeal the judge's decision and that it will win because he believes the judge was wrong on the special master.
Trump administration Attorney General William Barr said Wednesday that he believes the Justice Department is “getting very close” to having enough evidence to indict former President Donald Trump for keeping classified government documents at his private Florida residence long after his presidency.

Speaking on Fox News, Barr said that investigators will need to consider whether they can make a “technical” case against the former president for mishandling sensitive, even top secret, documents that the FBI found while searching the Mar-a-Lago property last month.

“I think they’re getting very close to that point, frankly,” he said.

On Tuesday, Barr called out a judge’s decision to grant Trump’s request for a “special master” to review the documents federal agents retrieved from Mar-a-Lago estate.

The DOJ had opposed the request, saying it had already reviewed most of the potentially classified records, but U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon ultimately sided with the former president, ruling the DOJ should temporarily stop using any of the seized documents for its investigation.

“The opinion, I think, was wrong, and I think the government should appeal it,” Barr told Fox News. “It’s deeply flawed in a number of ways.”

The DOJ has not signaled whether it will appeal the decision. A spokesperson on Monday told CNN they are considering “appropriate next steps.”

Barr argued the special master appointment — even if it goes through — won’t affect the outcome of the probe, apart from delaying it.

“The fundamental dynamics of the case are set, which is the government has very strong evidence of what it really needs to determine whether charges are appropriate,” Barr told Fox News.

Barr explained the Justice Department does not need to show the content of the seized records “in order to prevail in this case.”

Justice Department officials found classified information when they searched Trump’s Florida resort on Aug. 8, even though the former president’s team had asserted they had returned all such records. This stands regardless of the special master appointment, Barr explained.
"I am not an American ... In my view premarital sex should be illegal ...(there are) mentally challenged people with special needs like myself- Ajax18
User avatar
Dwight
Deacon
Posts: 238
Joined: Sun May 02, 2021 3:33 pm
Location: The North

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Dwight »

I'm sorry, but I just can't buy that leaks about their being a document seized about the nuclear capabilities of another country could be worse than that information having gotten to someone it shouldn't. The document is safely in the FBI's hands now, and who knows who Trump could have shown it to, or gotten a snapshot of it.

Also regardless of the contents, I don't think anyone is really disputing that under the Presidential Records Act all of these documents, or most of them, belong with the archivist. They belong to the public, even if due to security and executive privilege the public can never see them. Also the PRA is clear that anything about executive privilege should be handled by the DC courts. the Supreme Court has also clearly ruled that executive privilege cannot be used to cover up a crime.
Gunnar
God
Posts: 2338
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 6:32 pm
Location: California

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Gunnar »

Vēritās wrote:
Thu Sep 08, 2022 1:17 am
Bill Barr believes the DOJ will or should appeal the judge's decision and that it will win because he believes the judge was wrong on the special master.
The problem with that is that before and especially since Trump's presidency, The Republicans with the leadership of Senator McConnell and the collusion of the hard right Federalist Society have successfully so infused and contaminated the Federal Court System with highly partisan, hard right and even incompetent judges at all levels, that the appeal courts likely to hear the appeal, all the way up to the Supreme Court itself, would be likely to affirm Judge Cannon's ridiculous and indefensible Trump-serving ruling.

IT CAN'T STAND' Garland R.IPS Trump's Judge to SHREDS with most B.RUTAL 'appeal' case ever

Prior to Trump and the huge roster of highly partisan judges he has had the opportunity to nominate, this ruling would probably have been quickly overruled at the very first appeal, even by conservative judges. But now we have a Federal Court System that is suffused with judges more loyal to Trump than to the U.S. Constitution they have sworn under oath to defend.
No precept or claim is more suspect or more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
Chap
God
Posts: 2308
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 8:42 am
Location: On the imaginary axis

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Chap »

Chap wrote:
Wed Sep 07, 2022 8:19 pm
This could be:

(a) About a NATO ally. That would be the UK or France, the only other two nuclear armed countries in that alliance apart from the US.

OR

(b) About a third country that might be a potential adversary.


It does not appear to be in dispute that Trump had indeed taken some extremely secret material to Mar-A-Lago. That's very bad for the US in any case. If that secret material included something falling under (a) or (b), it is a whole lot worse. We shall have to wait and see, shan't we?

Though in the interim, there will certainly be at least two countries telephoning the White House to say "OK. Level with us. We need to know: did Trump take stuff that directly bears on our national security? And don't give us that 'have to wait for the special master' stuff. Tell us now."

Dwight wrote:
Thu Sep 08, 2022 7:07 am
I'm sorry, but I just can't buy that leaks about their being a document seized about the nuclear capabilities of another country could be worse than that information having gotten to someone it shouldn't. The document is safely in the FBI's hands now, and who knows who Trump could have shown it to, or gotten a snapshot of it.
I don't think anybody is worried about the fact there has been a leak suggesting that Trump on leaving the White House may have made off with (and then insecurely stored) highly classified documents that pose a risk to another country's security.

It's not the leak in itself that is concerning, but the fact that such an event was even a possibility.

Let's put it this way: if Americans chose to elect an amoral narcissist who is cunning rather than intelligent to manage their affairs, then so far as the consequences of that choice fall only on Americans, other countries don't have much to say. But if it turns out that the said amoral narcissist, once deprived of office, was allowed to take away documents of the highest security importance to allies (assuming (a) above is the case), those allies may feel entitled to say "You let him do WHAT? Don't you have any kind of system for checking what an ex-president takes away with him?". And one might also hear those allies expressing some surprise that it took so long before the US document custody system noticed and reacted to the fact that piles of secret documents that should have stayed in the White House were no longer there.

Of course, once again we face the fact that the rules and procedures set up to deal with what ex-Presidents may do were drawn up at a time when a president like Trump was inconceivable. They clearly need to be changed, do they not?
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
Mayan Elephant:
Not only have I denounced the Big Lie, I have denounced the Big lie big lie.
User avatar
Moksha
God
Posts: 5810
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:13 am
Location: Koloburbia

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Moksha »

Say for instance a criminal President takes a huge dump in the judicial watershed, polluting it downstream, can any remedy be made or should people just get used to crappy-tasting water?

Some judges owe their allegiance to the Constitution and some swear their fealty to Trump. The fealty to Trumpers even makes up the majority of the Appeals and Supreme Court.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
User avatar
Doctor CamNC4Me
God
Posts: 8979
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 2:04 am

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Doctor CamNC4Me »

Lol@qtards:

https://thehill.com/policy/national-sec ... acy-trial/

Tl;dr - Oathkeeper insurrectionist keeps firing lawyers and requested a special master because, I guess that’s what Trump does?

:roll:

- Doc
Hugh Nibley claimed he bumped into Adolf Hitler, Albert Einstein, Winston Churchill, Gertrude Stein, and the Grand Duke Vladimir Romanoff. Dishonesty is baked into Mormonism.
User avatar
Res Ipsa
God
Posts: 9568
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:44 pm
Location: Playing Rabbits

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Res Ipsa »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 5:36 pm
Lol@qtards:

https://thehill.com/policy/national-sec ... acy-trial/

Tl;dr - Oathkeeper insurrectionist keeps firing lawyers and requested a special master because, I guess that’s what Trump does?

:roll:

- Doc
He’s scared to death of going to trial and facing a jury. He tried to get a continuance out of the blue a couple of weeks ago after claiming he wasn’t getting along with his lawyers. Judge Mehta ain’t having any of it.

The only reason he did this is that Trump did it.

FAFO in action.
he/him
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.

Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
Vēritās
God
Posts: 1555
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2022 2:51 am

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Vēritās »

More from the affidavit was disclosed and it seems like team Trump refused to let them see what was in the boxes when they were issuing the subpoena. So much for "complying" huh?

When a single Democrat tried to explain to Team FOX that Trump didn't "comply" with the subpoena, Gutfeld went nuts basically calling her a liar. But she was right, and the fact that FOX can't acknowledge a simple incontrovertible fact like this tells you just how devoted they are to creating alternative realities for their naïve audience.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vqbw0Omjd_o
"I am not an American ... In my view premarital sex should be illegal ...(there are) mentally challenged people with special needs like myself- Ajax18
User avatar
Moksha
God
Posts: 5810
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:13 am
Location: Koloburbia

Re: Mar-A-Lago Legally Searched by FBI

Post by Moksha »

I'm surprised Trump did not request Judge Jeanine Pirro to be the Special Master.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
Post Reply