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doubtingthomas
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Re: What's the solution to the illegal immigration crisis? Sincere question.

Post by doubtingthomas »

Marcus wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:04 pm
Your title is unclear. Illegal immigrants are NOT the issue?
The issue is the guys who come here and leave.
doubtingthomas
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Re: Matt Gaetz sought pardon related to Justice Department sex trafficking probe

Post by doubtingthomas »

honorentheos wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 11:47 pm
Alternatively, consider working through this in a more healthy non-deflective manner.
1101 1010 T 1110 1101 0x11

There you go.
Vēritās
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Re: What's the solution to the illegal immigration crisis? Sincere question.

Post by Vēritās »

doubtingthomas wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 11:48 pm
Marcus wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:04 pm
Your title is unclear. Illegal immigrants are NOT the issue?
The issue is the guys who come here and leave.
You don't read your own links. You ignored the first part of that CATO piece which said that money paid was for transportation TO THE BORDER TO APPLY FOR ASYLUM. There is absolutely no way to know what percentage of people pay smugglers to get INSIDE the border. What you're whining about is whether desperate people choose to pay for transportation to the border as opposed to walking thousands of miles through multiple countries. The latest wave is from Venezuela. Surely you don't expect them to pay nothing for transportation? Are some of these networks criminal? Sure, most likely. Are some of them dealing drugs and child trafficking? Probably so. But what does that have to do with anything really? You make it sound like these people are just as complicit in sex trafficking or drug smuggling.

You're a fool if you actually believe 80-95% of the people have paid thousands of dollars. It doesn't break down what percentage was over $100 let alone $9,000. Remember the massive parade of marching immigrants Trump and FOX News was getting people all terrified over a few years ago? Why didn't then pay smugglers?

And this is like the third time you've repeated this "they go back to buy nice houses in Mexico" B.S. You haven't supported it with anything.
doubtingthomas
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Re: What's the solution to the illegal immigration crisis? Sincere question.

Post by doubtingthomas »

Vēritās wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:21 am
Surely you don't expect them to pay nothing for transportation? Are some of these networks criminal? Sure, most likely. Are some of them dealing drugs and child trafficking? Probably so. But what does that have to do with anything really? You make it sound like these people are just as complicit in sex trafficking or drug smuggling.
You don't think there should be a penalty for people who pay criminal organizations?
Vēritās wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:21 am
You're a fool if you actually believe 80-95% of the people have paid thousands of dollars.
I do not believe that, but some do, especially the ones who come here to work in construction.

"Migrants typically pay 8,000 dollars to 10,000 dollars to be taken across the border, loaded into a tractor-trailer and driven to San Antonio, where they transfer to smaller vehicles for their final destinations across the United States, said Craig Larrabee, acting special agent in charge of Homeland Security Investigations in San Antonio."
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international ... 445_4.html
Vēritās wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:21 am
And this is like the third time you've repeated this "they go back to buy nice houses in Mexico" B.S. You haven't supported it with anything.

Do you think all of them just stay here and never go back to Mexico? How much do undocumented construction workers make? Any idea? Of course, you can easily find reports of many who are exploited, but the reality is nobody knows what their income on average is. However, there are some who do make good money.
Vēritās
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Re: What's the solution to the illegal immigration crisis? Sincere question.

Post by Vēritās »

doubtingthomas wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:41 am
You don't think there should be a penalty for people who pay criminal organizations?
Do I think people fleeing tyranny and communism who desperately pay for transportation to the border to apply for asylum should be treated as criminals? no.
I do not believe that, but some do, especially the ones who come here to work in construction.
"Migrants typically pay 8,000 dollars to 10,000 dollars to be taken across the border, loaded into a tractor-trailer and driven to San Antonio, where they transfer to smaller vehicles for their final destinations across the United States, said Craig Larrabee, acting special agent in charge of Homeland Security Investigations in San Antonio."
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international ... 445_4.html
That's in reference to the relatively few people who pay to get inside, which does not represent 80-95%. I suspect it represents less than a quarter of all migrants trying to get in. Just look at the numbers of people who show up at the border to apply for asylum and those who are deported back. Obviously they didn't pay thousands of dollars to get to their "final destination" somewhere in the heartland via rental car.
Do you think all of them just stay here and never go back to Mexico?
You're the one repeating a bogus claim, now back it up for once instead of repeating it. Who do you know who has come here to work temporarily just so he can go back to buy a "nice" house in Mexico? What makes a house "nice" in Mexico anyhow? The scenario is fraught with too many assumptions and illogical ones at that. It assumes they're not really coming here to flee anything. All the unaccompanied children migrants are apparently, in your mind, coming here to work so they can go back and buy their Mom a house in Mexico? In fact, why worry about migrants at all if you truly believe they all go back to Mexico anyway?
How much do undocumented construction workers make? Any idea? Of course, you can easily find reports of many who are exploited, but the reality is nobody knows what their income on average is. However, there are some who do make good money.
Compared to Mexican money, yes. But they come for a better life risking the lives of their families to come here, not just for a temporary layover. Your complaints about migrants don't hold water. You're trying to paint them as tax dodging rascals who are only here to use us so they can live better in Mexico. The fact is we have a shortage of workers and the economy would do well to let more in. The fact is Americans who are here legally work under the table all the time and have mastered that system better than any Juan who just came over here. In many cases these folks actually do pay into social security and employer taxes which they will never ever get to benefit from.
Res Ipsa
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Re: Construction workers

Post by Res Ipsa »

Just a note: asylum seekers don’t have to pay a Coyote anything. They can present themselves at a pier of entry. Our step on US soil anywhere.
he/him
"Everything we see hides another thing, we always want to see what is hidden by what we see."
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Doctor Steuss
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Re: Construction workers

Post by Doctor Steuss »

The evolution of the thread title is cracking me up.
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Binger
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Re: Matt Gaetz sought pardon related to Justice Department sex trafficking probe

Post by Binger »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Tue Sep 20, 2022 6:35 pm
Matt Gaetz had sex with minors.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/joel-gree ... with-minor

tl;dr - Matt Gaetz had sex with minors.

- Doc
Oh dang.

Turns out to be a concocted lie. No charges.

Where does this story, including the tl;dr, fit in the conspiracy theory timeline and process?

File this one with the vaccines, masks, Ukraine, Jussie Smollet and BYU volleyball.
doubtingthomas
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Re: What's the solution to the illegal immigration crisis? Sincere question.

Post by doubtingthomas »

Vēritās wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:45 pm
That's in reference to the relatively few people who pay to get inside, which does not represent 80-95%. I suspect it represents less than a quarter of all migrants trying to get in.
A quarter is a lot.
Vēritās wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:45 pm
Who do you know who has come here to work temporarily just so he can go back to buy a "nice" house in Mexico? What makes a house "nice" in Mexico anyhow?
We don't know how many undocumented immigrants come here through sophisticated subterranean drugs tunnels connecting the US and Mexico, but it could be a large number.

Yes, there are undocumented immigrants who return to Mexico with a lot of cash, it's way more common than you think.

"At the same time, a returning migrant is a person who has been able to achieve his/her original goals for migrating (e.g. has accumulated enough savings). The person may not have gained major skills because his goal was not to integrate into the host country but to work as hard as possible to save enough money to achieve very specific goals. In this approach, used primarily to analyze temporary labor migration, return is an expected and generally planned action, especially if the rest of the family remains in the home country, and the migrant has a reason to return."
https://ccis.ucsd.edu/_files/wp193.pdf

The boyfriend of an ex-sister-in-law (Okay I wasn't really married to her sister) is working here (came here illegally) and plans to return Mexico with a lot of cash. My ex-sister-in-law still lives in Mexico, she is waiting for him.
Res Ipsa wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:14 pm
Just a note: asylum seekers don’t have to pay a Coyote anything. They can present themselves at a pier of entry. Our step on US soil anywhere.
I'm not complaining about the majority of undocumented immigrants. More undocumented women here would be good for society.
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Binger
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Re: What's the solution to the illegal immigration crisis? Sincere question.

Post by Binger »

doubtingthomas wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 10:13 pm
More undocumented women here would be good for society.
WTF?

On the one hand, congratulations if you think you know what is a woman. I mean, you could be talking about anything, really.

But then again, on the other hand? WTF? That is an insane suggestion.
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