Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

The Off-Topic forum for anything non-LDS related, such as sports or politics. Rated PG through PG-13.
User avatar
ajax18
God
Posts: 2717
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:12 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by ajax18 »

Manafort speaks very highly of his wife Kathy and was more upset by what the special council had done to her life than he was concerned for his own. But Kathy, unlike many women I've observed, did not leave Paul nor stop supporting him the entire time he was in prison. She really doesn't even care about losing everything financially. She's just happy to have her husband back. I guess there are good women out there after all.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
User avatar
canpakes
God
Posts: 7062
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:25 am

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by canpakes »

ajax18 wrote:
Thu Dec 29, 2022 11:41 pm
Manafort speaks very highly of his wife Kathy and was more upset by what the special council had done to her life than he was concerned for his own. But Kathy, unlike many women I've observed, did not leave Paul nor stop supporting him the entire time he was in prison. She really doesn't even care about losing everything financially. She's just happy to have her husband back. I guess there are good women out there after all.
Hooray for women who stand by their fraudster millionaire husbands.

Are you going to post some kind words for Hillary, now? : )
User avatar
ajax18
God
Posts: 2717
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:12 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by ajax18 »

Not exactly the type of thing that requires a comic-book level evil genius prosecutor, and a conniving lying rat. Either the basic black-and-white financial evidence is there that it happened, or it isn't. It shouldn't be surprising that this also happens to be something that he can't blame on someone else.
Ultimately the bank fraud was Manafort's word against Gates testimony given in exchange for immunity in front of the jury. Weissman had the money and talent to blow the jury away with complexity over three weeks and they ultimately believed Gates. There was someone to blame. It was Rick Gates. The only thing Manafort did wrong was to trust Rick Gates with his finances and this was what he admitted to and took responsibility for. But none of this would have ever happened or have gotten a second look if Manafort did not serve as Trump's campaign manager.

Weissman had Manafort's accountant in tears. Even most good people do buckle under the pressure and tell the prosecutor what he wants to hear when they're intimidated, threatened, and abused the way Weissman does.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
User avatar
Doctor Steuss
God
Posts: 1671
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:48 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by Doctor Steuss »

ajax18 wrote:
Thu Dec 29, 2022 11:47 pm
Not exactly the type of thing that requires a comic-book level evil genius prosecutor, and a conniving lying rat. Either the basic black-and-white financial evidence is there that it happened, or it isn't. It shouldn't be surprising that this also happens to be something that he can't blame on someone else.
Ultimately the bank fraud was Manafort's word against Gates testimony given in exchange for immunity. Weissman had the money and talent to blow the jury away with complexity over three weeks and they ultimately believed Gates. There was someone to blame. It was Rick Gates.

Weissman had Manafort's accountant in tears. Even most good people do buckle undrer the pressure and tell the prosecutor what he wants to hear when they're intimidated, threatened, and abused the way Weissman does.
There's probably a very good chance that Gates was largely responsible for the other stuff. Dishonest and unethical people tend to be drawn to each other.

Gates wasn't responsible for Manafort's dishonesty and unethical behavior though. Particularly when it comes to a black-and-white charge, that needs black-and-white evidence, that every single juror agreed on. Again, it shouldn't be surprising that the charges that couldn't employ a "he-said-she-said" strategy of finger-pointing all landed solidly.

Given that he's now seemingly able to convince people that he didn't do what he plainly did, he's got a bright financial future ahead of him. Or at the very least, a very bright political future.
User avatar
ajax18
God
Posts: 2717
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:12 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by ajax18 »

Not exactly the type of thing that requires a comic-book level evil genius prosecutor, and a conniving lying rat. Either the basic black-and-white financial evidence is there that it happened, or it isn't. It shouldn't be surprising that this also happens to be something that he can't blame on someone else.
Ultimately the bank fraud was Manafort's word against Gates testimony given in exchange for immunity in front of the jury. Weissman had the money and talent to blow the jury away with complexity over three weeks and they ultimately believed Gates. There was someone to blame. It was Rick Gates. The only thing Manafort did wrong was to trust Rick Gates with his finances and this was what he admitted to and took responsibility for. But none of this would have ever happened or have gotten a second look if Manafort did not serve as Trump's campaign manager.

Weissman had Manafort's accountant in tears. Even most good people do buckle under the pressure and tell the prosecutor what he wants to hear when they're intimidated, threatened, and abused the way Weissman does.

I hope he does make money off this book. I'm just glad to finally get the opportunity to hear his side of the story.

And Veritas is right that I don't read books that often. Audiobooks are a great thing to have during traffic. My new Silverado actually interrupts my book to tell me which way to turn. Geez I love my truck, 4 wheel drive this time. I'm no legal genius nor a politician. It was interesting to see the inner workings of political campaigns. I never even knew a profession like Paul Manafort's existed.

Manafort talked about not feeling angry or bitter. Obviously I was angry for him. I fantasized about straightening out Weissman and limiting his power to inflict this kind of damage on people. But what I really want is what Manafort wants. I want to better every working man's standard of living through free market capitalism and respect of private property rights. That means every American citizen who is willing to legally labor and live by the sweat of their brow as God commanded.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
User avatar
ajax18
God
Posts: 2717
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:12 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by ajax18 »

Doctor Steuss wrote:
Thu Dec 29, 2022 11:59 pm
ajax18 wrote:
Thu Dec 29, 2022 11:47 pm


Ultimately the bank fraud was Manafort's word against Gates testimony given in exchange for immunity. Weissman had the money and talent to blow the jury away with complexity over three weeks and they ultimately believed Gates. There was someone to blame. It was Rick Gates.

Weissman had Manafort's accountant in tears. Even most good people do buckle undrer the pressure and tell the prosecutor what he wants to hear when they're intimidated, threatened, and abused the way Weissman does.
There's probably a very good chance that Gates was largely responsible for the other stuff. Dishonest and unethical people tend to be drawn to each other.

Gates wasn't responsible for Manafort's dishonesty and unethical behavior though. Particularly when it comes to a black-and-white charge, that needs black-and-white evidence, that every single juror agreed on. Again, it shouldn't be surprising that the charges that couldn't employ a "he-said-she-said" strategy of finger-pointing all landed solidly.

Given that he's now seemingly able to convince people that he didn't do what he plainly did, he's got a bright financial future ahead of him. Or at the very least, a very bright political future.
Gates said Manafort ordered him to commit the bank fraud or whatever I'm forgetting the exact term. It was complex and probably hard for a jury to follow. Manafort said Gates did this on his own and hid it from Manafort, along with stealing from Manafort when the opportunity arose for him to do so. He did this to support multiple mistresses.

Still the point is that this was all politically motivated by the effort to take down Trump and the Russian Collusion narrative that turned out to be a lie. I don't understand why you can't see that. This board was ecstatic that Weissman was flipping witnesses by any means necessary and admitted how happy they were that his Russian collusion theory would finally get Trump out of office. Now you want to say your interest was in bringing Gates or Manafort to justice for failure to check the box on a FARA form? Few people on this board even knew what that was at the time.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
User avatar
Doctor Steuss
God
Posts: 1671
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:48 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by Doctor Steuss »

ajax18 wrote:
Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:36 am
Gates said Manafort ordered him to commit the bank fraud or whatever I'm forgetting the exact term. It was complex and probably hard for a jury to follow. Manafort said Gates did this on his own and hid it from Manafort, along with stealing from Manafort when the opportunity arose for him to do so. He did this to support multiple mistresses.
I'd wager that if their paths hadn't crossed, they'd likely still be successfully scheming individually. They deserved each other, and fortunately for America, their combined unethical and dishonest greed sunk both their ships.

They had Delaware LLCs dissolved for goodness sake, lol. That's something that even Trump's NFT LLC with an address in common with Ukrainian corruption king Pavlo Lazarenko has managed to skirt.
User avatar
canpakes
God
Posts: 7062
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:25 am

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by canpakes »

Manafort’s trial, held during August in Northern Virginia, stuck to financial crimes. The prosecution introduced the Ukrainian politician Viktor Yanukovych as a ‘cash spigot’ who showered Manafort with money for electoral advice. While Yanukovych was in power from 2010 to 2014, Manafort hid from the United States Treasury Department 31 offshore bank accounts holding more than $60m and dodged income tax on $16.5m. Documents show that Manafort used his shell company accounts to buy three homes worth $7.75m in one year. He spent $400,000 landscaping a fourth home with a flowering ‘M’ decorated by a waterfall and became a top-five customer at the luxury men’s shop Alan Couture (wiring nearly $1m), where his taste ran to jeans made of cashmere and jackets made of ostrich or python skin.

Ostentation isn’t a crime, as the judge tartly noted, but the prosecutors sought to establish that Manafort was hooked on it. When Yanukovych left office, they argued, Manafort resorted to bank fraud because his cash spigot dried up and he needed to summon cash ‘out of thin air’. In or around 2016, Manafort repeatedly doctored his profit statements and vastly exaggerated his earnings in order to obtain four loans from three banks worth more than $20m. As the government summed up its case at closing: ‘Manafort lied to keep more money when he had it, and lied to get more money when he didn’t.’


- - International Bar Association
https://www.ibanet.org/article/E1C69E69 ... E6D65C769F

And according to ajax, Manafort had no idea that Manafort was doing these things …
User avatar
ajax18
God
Posts: 2717
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:12 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by ajax18 »

Doctor Steuss wrote:
Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:58 am
ajax18 wrote:
Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:36 am
Gates said Manafort ordered him to commit the bank fraud or whatever I'm forgetting the exact term. It was complex and probably hard for a jury to follow. Manafort said Gates did this on his own and hid it from Manafort, along with stealing from Manafort when the opportunity arose for him to do so. He did this to support multiple mistresses.
I'd wager that if their paths hadn't crossed, they'd likely still be successfully scheming individually. They deserved each other, and fortunately for America, their combined unethical and dishonest greed sunk both their ships.

They had Delaware LLCs dissolved for goodness sake, lol. That's something that even Trump's NFT LLC with an address in common with Ukrainian corruption king Pavlo Lazarenko has managed to skirt.


Even though it was the special counsel who brought the the bank fraud charges and not the banks? What exactly did this very expensive taxpayer funded partisan political Mueller investigation do to benefit America?

Would you have been outraged if Manafort had said what Weissman wanted him to say on the witness stand against Trump in exchage for immunity as Gates had done?
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
User avatar
Doctor Steuss
God
Posts: 1671
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:48 pm

Re: Political Prisoner Persecuted , Prosecuted, but not silenced

Post by Doctor Steuss »

ajax18 wrote:
Fri Dec 30, 2022 1:45 am
Even though it was the special counsel who brought the the bank fraud charges and not the banks? What exactly did this very expensive taxpayer funded partisan political Mueller investigation do to benefit America?
Ummm... Citizen's Bank was a co-conspirator, lol. That's laid out in the 32-page indictment where it documents how they doctored a financial statement for Manafort (and did such a bad job of it, that one employee co-conspirator sent it back to be redone cleaner saying "Looks Dr'd"). Let me guess, Manafort conveniently left out that part in his book. Citizen's Bank has been the subject of SEC, CFPB and FDIC investigations, fines, and charges for decades.

As just one example, in 2015 (y'know, before Mueller) after an investigation by the SEC, they were hit with about $35 million in penalties for stealing millions of dollars from customers from 2008-2013.

As I noted earlier, dishonest people are drawn to each other. Same goes for businesses.
Would you have been outraged if Manafort had said what Weissman wanted him to say on the witness stand against Trump in exchage for immunity as Gates had done?
If he were to have said stuff on the witness stand, under oath, that was untrue, I'd hope he'd be found out and charged accordingly.

If "what Weissman wanted him to say" is only coming from Manafort, I'd wager it's probably another self-serving lie. That's what unethical and dishonest people like him do. They lie. A lot.
Post Reply