O Come O Come Emmanuel

[Chap]

No, he's saying that the meaning that Joseph Smith produced doesn't resemble the meaning that expert Egyptologists typically produce when they translate typical Egyptian hieroglyphics to English. "And therefore what?" = Joseph Smith was lying about having the gift to translate.

Dr. Shades, how does that follow?

Look KS, you are behaving like a low-grade chatbot. If that's the way you want to be, feel free. But you going to end up ignored.

[KevinSim]

Explaining that the DOE didn't think the idea of cold fusion had merit in 1989 and 2004, and explaining that that idea is not currently published in peer reviewed journals, does not imply that it would be tragic to carry on a fair debate over the idea of cold fusion.

A “fair” debate? Wasting people’s time insisting they discuss nonsense is tragic.
There is currently no accepted theoretical model that would allow cold fusion to occur.

I'm not insisting that anyone discuss anything. I'm simply saying there should be a forum at which people can have a fair debate of any issue they choose. Nobody has to show up to such a debate if they don't want to.

[Marcus]

A “fair” debate? Wasting people’s time insisting they discuss nonsense is tragic.
There is currently no accepted theoretical model that would allow cold fusion to occur.

I'm not insisting that anyone discuss anything. I'm simply saying there should be a forum at which people can have a fair debate of any issue they choose. Nobody has to show up to such a debate if they don't want to.

To get back to the topic, back on page 4 there was this response to the initial comment about needing a neutral forum for discussion:

If someone really wants to know the truth (about the Book of Abraham [...] then that someone needs to set up a forum and get enough people involved in that forum that the LDS Church (or whatever organization is involved) feels motivated to make its best case regarding the matter.

There, I regret to have to say, I disagree with you. There used to be an ExMormon poster on this board, who once coined the immortal saying "The Mormon religion isn't just not true, it's obviously not true". That may perhaps be unfair when applied to the religion as a whole.

I suspect, however, that any reasonable person accustomed to weighing historical evidence, and who was not brought up in the Mormon religion by their parents, has only to read a neutral factual account of the origins and nature of the piece of 19th century English prose known as "The Book of Abraham" to realise that it is simply not worth spending time on any further investigation of whether it is what it purports to be. Historians of folk religion in early 19th century America will no doubt find this text of interest but they are a fairly limited group.

Chap’s response pointed out clearly that neutral information was readily available, hence no need for a forum. (Not that people can’t discuss whatever they want, but the question of neutral information was clearly addressed. Not sure what KS’s point is in chatbotting the thread.)

[Dr. Shades]

Dr. Shades, how does that follow?

Allow me to demonstrate. First, do you speak any languages besides English?

[Bret Ripley]

Dr. Shades, how does that follow?

Allow me to demonstrate. First, do you speak any languages besides English?

"Il fait très froid aujourd'hui n'est-ce pas?" means "bananas are good." Fight me.

[honorentheos]

Allow me to demonstrate. First, do you speak any languages besides English?

"Il fait très froid aujourd'hui n'est-ce pas?" means "bananas are good." Fight me.

My high school French class made liberal use of Téléfrançais...

[Bret Ripley]

"Il fait très froid aujourd'hui n'est-ce pas?" means "bananas are good." Fight me.

My high school French class made liberal use of Téléfrançais...

You poor, poor bastard. Téléfrançais wasn't available yet, so instead we got to watch things like "Le Grand Blond avec une chaussure noire" (The Man in the Iron Mask) and "Les Misérables" (Tootsie). One student suggested we watch "La Cage aux Folles" but nobody else was interested in documentaries.

[honorentheos]

My high school French class made liberal use of Téléfrançais...

You poor, poor bastard. Téléfrançais wasn't available yet, so instead we got to watch things like "Le Grand Blond avec une chaussure noire" (The Man in the Iron Mask) and "Les Misérables" (Tootsie). One student suggested we watch "La Cage aux Folles" but nobody else was interested in documentaries.

Lol. Though, that explains the culture difference. I have to be content having determined, "Suis-je une banane? Non merci, je ne suis pas une banane! Je suis un ananas!"

Quality education, that.

ETA: I don't think it's a stretch to guess my having taken both French and German in high school led to my being called to the Swiss Zurich mission. The irony to me being my high school French would have only came in handy if a) I needed to find a library, or b) an anthropomorphic pineapple having an existential crisis who only spoke French answered the door while we were tracting...

[Bret Ripley]

ETA: I don't think it's a stretch to guess my having taken both French and German in high school led to my being called to the Swiss Zurich mission. The irony to me being my high school French would have only came in handy if a) I needed to find a library,

I can relate: in 2005 I was fortunate enough to spend a short time in France, and do you know I never once saw a cat under a table or found myself in an establishment where the restrooms were not well-signed? Not to be dissuaded, I once tried ordering a meal en français and ended up with a heaping plate of tripe. I stuck with l'anglais after that, thereby averting any additional culinary hostility. *

or b) an anthropomorphic pineapple having an existential crisis who only spoke French answered the door while we were tracting...

Huh. I think I would have found that deeply disturbing, personally, but perhaps the combination of missionary training and Téléfrançais leaves one prepared to deal with the Kafkaesque.

* On the quality of my French I will add only this: I was the only non-Brit in our little party, and my companions all assured me that even with my comical Yankee accent my English would pose less risk to Entente Cordiale.

[honorentheos]

One thing I find funny to think about is the etymology of words in European languages that had to have their origins in post-colonialism. In French, the South American potato earned a poetic, "Apple of the Earth" in apparent adoration by whomever got to name it after its import to Europe, presumably someone royal given the times. While the indigenous name for pineapple seems to be behind the French word and is more romantic as well, I like to imagine there was also some onomatopoeia involved...as if the person recording the name got some of the juice in the eye.