Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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ajax18 wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 1:13 am
a two tiered criminal justice system based on race, gender, or political affiliation
Leaving aside the questions of gender or political affiliation, I think that all honest people acquainted with the history of the United States would affirm that the system of justice operated throughout the country at all levels has at all times been administered by judges (and, where applicable, juries) who are rigid in their adherence to the principle of equal justice for all, without reference to the ethnic origins of those who stand before them, whether as defendants, plaintiffs or witnesses.

So I find ajax18's suggestion that there may have been any deviation from that principle deeply shocking and even unpatriotic.

:roll:
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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ajax18 wrote:
Sat May 20, 2023 5:05 pm
Anyone who tries to make anything more out of this is just exploiting the suffering of others for their own advantage. That goes for both progressives and MAGA types.
Do you think she has a strong civil claim for defamation against NBC and a claim against the hospital for suspending her without pay? Would you voter for her to recover anything if you were on the jury or would you say she has no claim?
No on NBC. They reported on a viral video and what it “appeared” to show. The reporting wasn’t false. On the hospital, all I saw was that she was suspended — not that she was suspended without pay. I’d be surprised if the suspension was without pay. However, you right wingers have been passing “right to work” laws left and right for years. The result is at will employment, which allows the employer to suspend or fire an employee for any reason that doesn’t violate non-discrimination or anti-retaliation statutes. So, you don’t have much standing to complain about her employer.

Some PAs in New York are unionized. If she were lucky enough to belong to a union, her employment would be protected by a union contract. Or if she is lucky enough to have some sort of contract that requires “cause” for firing, she may be protected. But if she is like the vast majority of Americans, her employer has the right to suspend or fire her for whatever reason.
Ajax18 wrote:Do you think the African American teens should be charged with attempted robbery or would their claim that they thought they had paid for the bike absolve them of any criminal exposure? I remember Mr. Scratch explained to me that racism and reverse racism should never be on equal footing. Do you also espouse the idea of different set of rules for blacks and whites because of the USA's history and current level of systemic racism?
Intent is an element of the crime of robbery. What the video shows is a dispute over who has paid for the bike rental. That’s not going to establish the necessary intent beyond a reasonable doubt. The race of the young men is irrelevant When it comes to whether there is probable cause to charge them with a crime.
Ajax18 wrote:Let's say the pregnant woman didn't have a receipt or she was just having a case of pregnant brain and mistaken. In your opinion should she have fired? In your opinion should conservative media have been sued for covering the story in error, because white black racism and reverse racism shouldn't be on equal footing?
She hasn’t been fired and I wouldn’t for an employee over this kind of thing. No media should be sued for covering something “in error.” All media make errors. The law of defamation doesn’t vary depending on the race of those involved. I suspect you’ve wildly over generalized whatever Dr. Scratch actually said about reverse discrimination.
Ajax18 wrote:ETA: One more question, if the woman were not white but rather Russian or another European immigrant, would she be judged under the same standard as a descendant of confederates like myself because of our similar level of pigmentation or would she be under a different standard because of her heritage? What if the woman were of mixed race, what set of rules should then be applied to her in this case?
I don’t understand what you are babbling about here. If you are talking about how she would be judged under the law, her race or cultural heritage doesn’t matter. If you mean judged in the court of public opinion, who knows?

The video obviously doesn’t tell the whole story. This is a disagreement that should have been resolved by comparing the rental confirmation on both phones. That may have happened, as at the beginning of the video, she is in possession of the black man’s phone. Why did he give it to her, if not to show confirmation? Why don’t we see her showing him the receipt on her phone? Why did this interaction escalate the way it did? We just don’t know.
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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Intent is an element of the crime of robbery. What the video shows is a dispute over who has paid for the bike rental. That’s not going to establish the necessary intent beyond a reasonable doubt. The race of the young men is irrelevant When it comes to whether there is probable cause to charge them with a crime.
I guess that's my question. If she were mistaken about having paid for the bike and it turned out that the black did pay for it and showed receipts, could or should she be charged with robbery, because that's what the civil rights activists were demanding.

What percentage of African American heritage will be required to collect reparations in California? Will it matter if the individuals ancestors actually were slaves rather than recent African immigrants?

What percentage of minority DNA is necessary to collect college money or for an employer to count this person to their quota for affirmative action purposes. For instance, did Elizabeth Warren count as Native American while she was employed at Harvard for the purposes of meeting the diversity quota? Or is it just a case of if you have self identified as a member of a minority group than you're eligible to collect regardless of your actual DNA makeup as an individual. i.e. Rachel Dolezal
Last edited by ajax18 on Mon May 22, 2023 5:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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No on NBC. They reported on a viral video and what it “appeared” to show. The reporting wasn’t false.
So why was Fox News liable for $727 million suit for defamation? It certainly appeared to me that the 2020 election had fraud in it. Is there no statute against showing partial videos out of context and stirring up costly protests and property damage?

Didn't CNN have to settle for quite a bit of money for taking a selectively edited video of Aaron Sandman and campaigning to get him immediately kicked out of school?
However, you right wingers have been passing “right to work” laws left and right for years. The result is at will employment, which allows the employer to suspend or fire an employee for any reason that doesn’t violate non-discrimination or anti-retaliation statutes. So, you don’t have much standing to complain about her employer.
The law isn't worth the paper it's printed on. It all comes down to how a judge and jury interpret the law. The statute against retaliation against whistleblowers in the FBI didn't protect conservatives. Maybe we don't discriminate against race or gender but there's sure as hell plenty of discrimination based upon political affiliation and opinion.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

Post by Chap »

ajax18 wrote:
Mon May 22, 2023 5:07 pm
The law isn't worth the paper it's printed on. It all comes down to how a judge and jury interpret the law.
Well, that bolded text applies to every single law on the statute book, doesn't it?

Since you don't like written laws, what do you prefer in order to stop bad stuff being done?

Is it just "We should choose a good guy and let him have all the powers he needs to deal with the bad guys without anybody interfering?".
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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ajax18 wrote:
Mon May 22, 2023 5:07 pm
No on NBC. They reported on a viral video and what it “appeared” to show. The reporting wasn’t false.
So why was Fox News liable for $727 million suit for defamation? It certainly appeared to me that the 2020 election had fraud in it. Is there no statute against showing partial videos out of context and stirring up costly protests and property damage?
Because there was substantial evidence that Fox News employees repeatedly made false statements about Dominion Voting systems after they had been provided with the true information. There was substantial evidence that they did so even though they knew the claims were false. No, there is not such statute. What part of the video did NBC not show that you think would have mattered. What context was NBC aware of but did not publish at the time it published its story? What "costly protests" resulted and what property was damaged?
Ajax18 wrote:Didn't CNN have to settle for quite a bit of money for taking a selectively edited video of Aaron Sandman and campaigning to get him immediately kicked out of school?
CNN didn't "have" to settle anything. They chose to settle before any substantial litigation costs were incurred. The amount of the settlement was confidential. As no discovery was conducted in the case, we don't know what the evidence was. Defamation suits can be very costly to defend, and we have no idea how much was paid as opposed to the cost of defense. Also, if CNN had applicable insurance, the insurance company typically has the right to settle cases it is defending for a policyholder.
Res Ipsa wrote:However, you right wingers have been passing “right to work” laws left and right for years. The result is at will employment, which allows the employer to suspend or fire an employee for any reason that doesn’t violate non-discrimination or anti-retaliation statutes. So, you don’t have much standing to complain about her employer.
Ajax18 wrote:The law isn't worth the paper it's printed on. It all comes down to how a judge and jury interpret the law. The statute against retaliation against whistleblowers in the FBI didn't protect conservatives. Maybe we don't discriminate against race or gender but there's sure as hell plenty of discrimination based upon political affiliation and opinion.
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

If the law doesn't mean anything, then why isn't every employee fired or laid off in in at will employment jurisdictions suing and winning cases against their former employers. The fact that you don't like how a handful of cases turned out doesn't mean that results in cases are random. Exactly which whistleblower law are you claiming didn't protect which conservatives in the FBI? Have you read what the law requires government employees to do to obtain whistleblower status and do you know whether the conservatives you are talking about followed the law? Or are you just regurgitating the vomit that regularly spews out of Jim Jordan's piehole?

If you want to make a case that the judicial system discriminates against conservative defendants, you're going to have to do better than cherry pick a few cases at the margins. The data shows that the people who are discriminated against by the judicial system tend to have skin colors other than white. That pretty much puts your claims about the system into the category of "delusion."
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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ajax18 wrote:
Mon May 22, 2023 4:57 pm
Res Ipsa wrote:Intent is an element of the crime of robbery. What the video shows is a dispute over who has paid for the bike rental. That’s not going to establish the necessary intent beyond a reasonable doubt. The race of the young men is irrelevant When it comes to whether there is probable cause to charge them with a crime.
I guess that's my question. If she were mistaken about having paid for the bike and it turned out that the black did pay for it and showed receipts, could or should she be charged with robbery, because that's what the civil rights activists were demanding.
That's the question I was answering. No, she couldn't or shouldn't. I don't care what Twitter lawyers were demanding.
Ajax18 wrote:What percentage of African American heritage will be required to collect reparations in California? Will it matter if the individuals ancestors actually were slaves rather than recent African immigrants?
What in the world does that question have to do with the bicycle incident? Did it happen in California? Are the three men involved demanding reparations? I don't live in California and really don't care what they decide to concerning reparations.
Ajax18 wrote:What percentage of minority DNA is necessary to collect college money or for an employer to count this person to their quota for affirmative action purposes. For instance, did Elizabeth Warren count as Native American while she was employed at Harvard for the purposes of meeting the diversity quota? Or is it just a case of if you have self identified as a member of a minority group than you're eligible to collect regardless of your actual DNA makeup as an individual. i.e. Rachel Dolezal
I was a student at Harvard Law School a few years before Elizabeth Warren was hiring. Hiring diversity was a hot button issue while I was there. I know, because I was editor in chief of the school newspaper (not the law review) and we put together a two issue, in depth look at the hiring issues. I personally did an extensive interview with the Dean. And I can tell you with 100% confidence that THERE WERE NO DIVERSITY QUOTAS. That's your racism showing. She was an excellent law professor and well-qualified to teach at HLS. I've seen no evidence that she ever got special treatment based on her belief that she had Native ancestry. The whole issue is a racist talking point that you've glommed onto because you're sure that folks with white skin are more qualified for everything than folks with darker skin.
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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Because there was substantial evidence that Fox News employees repeatedly made false statements about Dominion Voting systems after they had been provided with the true information.
According to the Durham report Obama, McCabe, and Comey knew that the Trump Russian/Collusion was a hoax. CNN did as well when they had them on TV to talk about it. They knew the pee tape was false and had access to that information.
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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ajax18 wrote:
Mon May 22, 2023 7:55 pm
Because there was substantial evidence that Fox News employees repeatedly made false statements about Dominion Voting systems after they had been provided with the true information.
According to the Durham report Obama, McCabe, and Comey knew that the Trump Russian/Collusion was a hoax. CNN did as well when they had them on TV to talk about it. They knew the pee tape was false and had access to that information.
What evidence does the Durham Report cite for all of that? And why didn't he file charges against Obama, McCabe, Comey and CNN? Why didn't Trump sue them for defamation?
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Re: Racist Karen steals black youths bike

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ajax18 wrote:
Mon May 22, 2023 7:55 pm
According to the Durham report Obama, McCabe, and Comey knew that the Trump Russian/Collusion was a hoax.
What page? I just looked at every single instance of Obama's name within the report (hooray for PDFs), and couldn't find this.

Ironically (juxtaposed with the above claim in the Durham report), one of the instances of Obama being mentioned within the report:
[Papadopoulos] also suggested the Trump team had received some kind of suggestion from Russia that it could assist this process with the anonymous release of information during the campaign that would be damaging to Mrs[.] Clinton (and President Obama).
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