You're Wrong

The Off-Topic forum for anything non-LDS related, such as sports or politics. Rated PG through PG-13.
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Some Schmo
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Re: You're Wrong

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I just finished listening to it. The description was misleading (or perhaps, I read too much into it). I thought you were going to argue people should swallow their reluctance.

But really, your argument is that the GOP needs somebody better this primary. Totally agree.

So, what will you do if Trump wins the nomination? Just not vote?

ETA: I enjoyed listening to you. Thought I should mention.
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Some Schmo
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Re: You're Wrong

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Tim wrote:
Tue May 30, 2023 11:01 pm
Thanks for checking it out. Did you happen to listen to it? Or did my vague description just trigger something for you?
Now that I've listened to what you had to say, I realize I was triggered by your vague description. As you pointed out, most people who use the term "woke" don't use it in any commonly definable way, and yeah, it's annoying.

I actually think you'd attract more traffic with a better description, because I enjoyed that podcast way more than I expected to. I could relate to pretty much everything you said.
Religion is for people whose existential fear is greater than their common sense.

The god idea is popular with desperate people.
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Tim
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Re: You're Wrong

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Some Schmo wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 7:46 pm
I actually think you'd attract more traffic with a better description, because I enjoyed that podcast way more than I expected to. I could relate to pretty much everything you said.
Thanks for listening and thanks for the encouragement. I made the description vague because I want people to actually evaluate my argument based on what I actually said, not what they think I'm going to say. I appreciate the frustration but ultimately the episode isn't for people who totally agree with me.

Share it with your friends!
Marcus
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Re: You're Wrong

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Tim wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 3:34 pm
...If someone is not willing to say Bill Clinton is a terrible human being with respect to how he treats women, then they probably shouldn't be surprised if no one cares what they say about Donald Trump. An ounce of consistency and a willingness to police your own side can go a long way in calling out the moral rot on the other side.
No, it doesn't work that way. I have always stated my extremely negative opinions about Clinton with regard to how he treats women. My 'consistency' and 'willingness to police' my own side have not helped at all when discussing the vile filth Trump injected into our political world, on every possible level and in every conceivable realm. The damage he did to our reputation on the world stage may never be undone. It is truly a shame that his absolute lack of character was allowed such leeway. And no, I've never heard a single Trump supporter adequately address these issues, regardless of how much 'whataboutism' came first and was acknowledged.
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Tim
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Re: You're Wrong

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Marcus wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 9:30 pm
I've never heard a single Trump supporter adequately address these issues, regardless of how much 'whataboutism' came first and was acknowledged.
It took me 20 years to finally hear people say that Clinton is a creep. It will happen (but unfortunately not on the appropriate timeline).
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Re: You're Wrong

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Tim wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 9:41 pm
Marcus wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 9:30 pm
I've never heard a single Trump supporter adequately address these issues, regardless of how much 'whataboutism' came first and was acknowledged.
It took me 20 years to finally hear people say that Clinton is a creep. It will happen (but unfortunately not on the appropriate timeline).
We must be on different timelines.
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Some Schmo
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Re: You're Wrong

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Tim wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 9:19 pm
Some Schmo wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 7:46 pm
I actually think you'd attract more traffic with a better description, because I enjoyed that podcast way more than I expected to. I could relate to pretty much everything you said.
Thanks for listening and thanks for the encouragement. I made the description vague because I want people to actually evaluate my argument based on what I actually said, not what they think I'm going to say. I appreciate the frustration but ultimately the episode isn't for people who totally agree with me.
I understand that, and I understand the desire to be somewhat vague, but not at the expense of listeners. And I don't think your description was as vague as it was misleading. The problem is that the content of the podcast may never be heard because you turn off potential listeners with emotionally charged words in the description (and we know "woke" is an emotionally charged word for both sides) that had almost nothing to do with what you were saying.

Of course, this is free advice, and we know free advice is usually worth the cost.
Religion is for people whose existential fear is greater than their common sense.

The god idea is popular with desperate people.
huckelberry
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Re: You're Wrong

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Tim wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 4:34 pm
Equality and Equity are often confused. I meant "Equity". As can be seen here
https://diversity.uiowa.edu/resources/dei-definitions

Do a search for D. E. I. and it will always include equity which means "equal outcomes" whereas equality means "equal opportunities"
Tim, your link defines equity as follows:
"Equity refers to fair and just practices and policies that ensure all campus community members can thrive. Equity is different than equality in that equality implies treating everyone as if their experiences are exactly the same. Being equitable means acknowledging and addressing structural inequalities — historic and current — that advantage some and disadvantage others. Equal treatment results in equity only if everyone starts with equal access to opportunities."

It does not say equal outcomes, equal outcomes is the phrase used by right leaning people to express a fear that some people will get unfair and unearned benefits at the expense of others. Or that is at least how I have most often heard the phrase used.

/////
Tim I did listen long enough to your comments to realize your were not attempting to explain why all true Christians need to vote Trump even if he looks bad sometimes.

I appreciated your coffee comments especially noting that trick presentation about lethal coffee dose
140 cups a day or so ..My coffee intake has faded over the years to some two to four cups. It may have been up to like eight to ten cups in some periods when I was much younger. I have heard of people running into health difficulties from too much caffeine,many extra strong doses.
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Gadianton
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Re: You're Wrong

Post by Gadianton »

I listened to the right podcast this time, I think. Most of it, anyway.

10 cups of coffee may actually kill me. 2 cups will make me sick and paranoid.

The JC bit was interesting, I knew nothing about the case and so I think I now know all I ever need to about it and that tiny loose end is tied up.

Like the Reverend, I admire your effort to influence unhinged right-wingers for the good, and I think your arguments were pretty creative and seem to be original and I'm guess not just copy/pasting trending material.

I'm not sure we'd agree on the motivations of the typical right-wing Christian who supports Trump, although I realize you're giving your audience the benefit of the doubt when you say maybe they think they need to vote for him because of his policies. You're not revealing necessarily why you think they vote for him.

Two main points. The first is that I believe Trump is a negative hero, the more bad he gets, the more his fans love him. Being a criminal and getting away with it both in the sense of avoiding prison but also maintaining power with his supporters is a big middle finger to the opposition.

The second point potentially stands independent of the first point. Perhaps the mission talk here reminded me of a story from my mission that relates, and this was way back in the 90s. My trainer in my first area was this big, soft-spoken guy; he had the presence of a born leader. He was quite formal and a stickler on rules. Well, as I got to know him and he eased up on the constant "Elder" this-and-that, I was surprised to learn that he was kind of a rebel in high school, he had long hair and listened to loud music. His parents were very TBM, his father was employed by the Church, in fact. At some point, and I can't recall how the conversation took this turn, he revealed that he had a bunch of posters of women in bikinis on his bedroom walls when he was in high school. I was blown away because for one, I couldn't place him as the kind of person who would do that. He was very intelligent, made me look like a rube; articulate, studied languages, both parents Phds, and I would have thought him as "above" that. I was also shocked that he got away with it in a TBM home. How was that possible, when his father worked for the Church? Ahh, it turned out there was an answer. He said it came up with his dad eventually, and his dad in so many words said he didn't like it or approve of it necessarily, but gave it a free pass because of the relief that he was into women. Okay, he had some effeminate mannerisms, and so maybe that made his dad suspicious.

The second point is that in the culture war, the religious right has gone so overboard over the threats to their family values that they wind up praising all things contrary to alternative lifestyles and women's rights, and the worse the example the better. And so Trump being a real man and "taking what was his", affirming the patriarchal role where the alpha treats women as his property not only trolls the left as in the first point I made, but the hyperbolic alpha masculinity, the "BDE" for all the Keri Lake supporters who are good Christians, creates something of a protective bubble around the Christian family core giving that much more buffer to ensure that friends and family members don't find themselves sympathetic to, and then exploited by the leftist plot to make people gay or trans. To be okay with Trump sexually assaulting women makes a person that much less likely to ever become gay or trans, in right-wing Christian thought.

When these points are understood, then it becomes very difficult to imagine how a right-wing Christian might be dissuaded from Trump.
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ajax18
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Re: You're Wrong

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Moksha wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 3:55 am
Trump seems the worst, but I realize the Republican party could pick someone worse. Evangelicals have been enamored of Trump to such a degree that I've been astounded. How did they get around the morality issue? Has their outward piety been a continual scam? What makes them so susceptible to Trump's lies? Bridget Jack Jeffries is an Evangelical and has not drunk that Kool-Aid. What gives her immunity?

Besides doctrinal issues, Evangelicals seem to have much in common with right-wing Mormons.

By the way, the choice to fall off the edge of the flat earth map or stay stationary in the water with the sea monsters really is not the totality of choices. I know it seems limiting because Romney is the only honest Republican left, but if you accept the curvature of the earth, a whole new horizon opens up.
Show me some evidence Mitt Romney is even still a Republican.

Funny that he was a tax cheating plutocrat according to your favorite Harry Reid when he was running for President. Now you call him honest when the only thing that comes out of his mouth is his eternal commitment and loyalty to the Deep State that funds his sons' businesses in a way not much different than how the Bidens made there under the table fortune.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
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