Lying is the Root of all Religion

[Res Ipsa]

Well, we can get into a whole discussion on the pros and cons of generalizations. Of course, there are exceptions to every rule. I just wonder how much traction the expression would have gotten over time if it was flat out B.S..

It just occurred to me that I'm defending the truth of a partial statement in the Bible and RI is intimating it's not true.

hehe

Yep. Stranger Things. I don't agree that the love of money is the root of all evil. But I disagree with lots of stuff in the Bible.

[Jersey Girl]

Hey SS


From a biblical Christianity stance, it's not "money is the root of all evil" - It is "For the love of money is the root of all evil."

Nice logic chopping.

- Doc

What do you mean by logic chopping? Schmo quoted an incomplete portion of scripture and ceeboo completed it. So...huh?

[Some Schmo]

I may have told this story here before, but my 9th grade English teacher started class one day by saying, "Today, we are going to construct a fool-proof BS detector." I was thrilled that he swore like that in class, and became transfixed by what he was going to say.

(It occurs to me that teachers should swear just a little more, for effect. Not too much, or it would lose effect, but just enough to get kids like me interested in what they're about to say. This has to be the high school memory I recall the most).

He went on to talk about generalizations, and then made a list of words that, if they appeared in a sentence, made the comment most likely BS. Words like:

- all
- every
- none
- never
- always
...etc.

So, by this measure, "money is the root of all evil" is BS because it contains the word "all." And to your point, RI, we can certainly think of instances where people do terrible things for reasons other than money.

The thing is, generalizations are a good shorthand for getting a simple idea across. We use them regularly, and my thought when I hear them is usually, "Well, that's probably not completely true, but I get your point." I sort of think of generalizations as good conversation starters, but terrible if left alone. Someone makes a generalization which almost requires others to get clarification.

[Res Ipsa]

I may have told this story here before, but my 9th grade English teacher started class one day by saying, "Today, we are going to construct a fool-proof B.S. detector." I was thrilled that he swore like that in class, and became transfixed by what he was going to say.

(It occurs to me that teachers should swear just a little more, for effect. Not too much, or it would lose effect, but just enough to get kids like me interested in what they're about to say. This has to be the high school memory I recall the most).

He went on to talk about generalizations, and then made a list of words that, if they appeared in a sentence, made the comment most likely B.S.. Words like:

- all
- every
- none
- never
- always
...etc.

So, by this measure, "money is the root of all evil" is B.S. because it contains the word "all." And to your point, RI, we can certainly think of instances where people do terrible things for reasons other than money.

The thing is, generalizations are a good shorthand for getting a simple idea across. We use them regularly, and my thought when I hear them is usually, "Well, that's probably not completely true, but I get your point." I sort of think of generalizations as good conversation starters, but terrible if left alone. Someone makes a generalization which almost requires others to get clarification.

I agree with what you're said, except that I would say that "generalizations can be a good shorthand for getting simple ideas across." It depends on the generalization and on the simple idea. And simple ideas aren't always good or accurate ideas.

For example, what happens if you ask folks here "What would you say is the root of all religion?" If you asked me, I'd say a combination of the bias toward patternicity and intentionality in our brains combined with the inability to imagine what it would be like to not exist. Would folks, unprompted, identify "lying" or "saying false things" as the root?

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Nice logic chopping.

- Doc

What do you mean by logic chopping? Schmo quoted an incomplete portion of scripture and ceeboo completed it. So...huh?

It was fallacious nitpicking designed to contrarian-undermine Some Schmo's assertion.

- Doc

[Some Schmo]

For example, what happens if you ask folks here "What would you say is the root of all religion?" If you asked me, I'd say a combination of the bias toward patternicity and intentionality in our brains combined with the inability to imagine what it would be like to not exist. Would folks, unprompted, identify "lying" or "saying false things" as the root?

I'm not sure how others might answer that question. Let's find out.

ETA: I have no doubt that the answers will be different and far ranging.

[ceeboo]

What do you mean by logic chopping? Schmo quoted an incomplete portion of scripture and ceeboo completed it. So...huh?

It was fallacious nitpicking designed to contrarian-undermine Some Schmo's assertion.

- Doc

No, I was not fallaciously nitpicking - and I had no motive to undermine anything or anybody.

I was providing the complete rendition in case it mattered to anyone involved in the thread.

[Jersey Girl]

What do you mean by logic chopping? Schmo quoted an incomplete portion of scripture and ceeboo completed it. So...huh?

It was fallacious nitpicking designed to contrarian-undermine Some Schmo's assertion.

- Doc

I would have done the same thing had not ceeboo done it. Here is why. Because to say money is the root of all evil isn't an accurate portrayal. To omit the the love of from the statement is to remove the element of greed that the scripture refers to.

[Jersey Girl]

I may have told this story here before, but my 9th grade English teacher started class one day by saying, "Today, we are going to construct a fool-proof BS detector." I was thrilled that he swore like that in class, and became transfixed by what he was going to say.

(It occurs to me that teachers should swear just a little more, for effect. Not too much, or it would lose effect, but just enough to get kids like me interested in what they're about to say. This has to be the high school memory I recall the most).

He went on to talk about generalizations, and then made a list of words that, if they appeared in a sentence, made the comment most likely BS. Words like:

- all
- every
- none
- never
- always
...etc.

So, by this measure, "money is the root of all evil" is BS because it contains the word "all." And to your point, RI, we can certainly think of instances where people do terrible things for reasons other than money.

The thing is, generalizations are a good shorthand for getting a simple idea across. We use them regularly, and my thought when I hear them is usually, "Well, that's probably not completely true, but I get your point." I sort of think of generalizations as good conversation starters, but terrible if left alone. Someone makes a generalization which almost requires others to get clarification.

I freaking love teachers like that! by the way, those words are often referred to as absolutes. A feature of many a cluster B personality disorder. (I'm serious though, it really is.)

[Some Schmo]

I would have done the same thing had not ceeboo done it. Here is why. Because to say money is the root of all evil isn't an accurate portrayal. To omit the the love of from the statement is to remove the element of greed that the scripture refers to.

So the expression that most people use is a misrepresentation of a Bible verse. Honestly, I learned something from this thread. I had no idea that was from the Bible.

Here's the thing: the expression, as I've always heard it, could be construed as demonizing the rich, casting them as an outgroup. Most people seem to have no problem with that.