Interview with Schmo

[Jersey Girl]

That’s great. Thank you, Jersey Girl.

My pleasure!

[Some Schmo]

So, I'm kind of bummed there are no follow up questions or comments, Jersey Girl.

Did I satisfy your curiosity? Were you going somewhere with your questions?

I'm cool with it if my answers were all you needed to know. I just thought you might have more in mind when you asked.

[Jersey Girl]

So, I'm kind of bummed there are no follow up questions or comments, Jersey Girl.

Did I satisfy your curiosity? Were you going somewhere with your questions?

I'm cool with it if my answers were all you needed to know. I just thought you might have more in mind when you asked.

No I'm not done yet! in real life got me going in a different direction so when I posted the past couple of days I did comments that were easy and that I didn't have to think 2 seconds about. Not so with my questions to you.

I'm coming back I promise!

[Moksha]

No I'm not done yet! in real life got me going in a different direction so when I posted the past couple of days I did comments that were easy and that I didn't have to think 2 seconds about. Not so with my questions to you.

I'm coming back I promise!

Ask him about his favorite dessert and whether he prefers fast or slow dancing.

[Jersey Girl]

Hey Schmo,

I'm starting a new thread so as not to derail your lying thread about lies and the lying liars who tell them. I have some questions for you if you don't mind answering.

Sure.

1. How long were you involved with the LDS church as an active member?

I was born into it and was active till I left home at 17.

Do you mind saying where you went when you left home? Did you have a relative to help you out? Feel free to pass on this question if it feels like too much disclosure.

Of course, there's a difference between being active and believing it.

Did you mostly never believe it? If so, do you remember what made your antenna go up? Red flag? What didn't make sense?

2. Was the LDS church your first experience with a religion?

Unless there's something to the idea of past lives, yes.

Got it.

3. Did you ever involve yourself in a different church and if so, how long did you attend?

I went to various churches with my friends on occasion. Catholic more than any others, although I've been to Baptist and 7th Day Adventist meetings. I've never seriously tried to join another church, if that's what you're asking. I didn't leave Mormonism because I was looking for something else. I left because I didn't like religion.

I think I get that. You didn't like the whole scene that constitutes religion. It was a giant turn off to you. Maybe you felt like it was too confining or that people are hypocrites or something.

Just as a matter of sharing, I was infant baptized Presbyterian (Scottish culture) but I was raised up in a non-denomination church but the pastor was schooled at Bob Jones University. I've attended base chapel Protestant and Catholic services. I've been to Lutheran (Catholic lite!), Presbyterian (can't recall what it was like) and I went to a Hindu service for a young man who committed suicide, the son of a co-worker*, I went to show support, I attended memorial services at one Mega Church (don't like those at all) and a Cowboy Church (loved it). Also have been to LDS Ward and Stake--baptism, Traveling Road Show, Ward talent show, a really nice Christmas gathering at the Ward where the members dressed in period clothing from the time of Christ's birth and it was set up sort of like a little village with peddlers and stuff you could sample--food, etc. I can't pick which one of those activities I liked best. I liked them all. I've been to Girl's Activity and did some training support for the LDS Boy Scout troop camping efforts through the local Ward.

*I had visited my coworker at her home and she helped me understand that because her son took his own life that he essentially destroyed his soul and ceased to exist. Schmo, it was SO sad but I knew right there and then I would go to the Hindu service. I'll show up just about anywhere to support a friend.

4. Were you baptized in the LDS church or any other church?

In the LDS church when I turned 8.

Would you say that you weren't a believer at that point and were just doing what was expected of you by your family and church culture? I was baptized by immersion at age 11 in a neighborhood church in my home town (my own church didn't have a baptismal pool at the time). It was summer and there were June bugs floating in the pool!

5. What was/is your favorite church song or hymn?

The music was part of the experience I didn't care for. Perhaps there were a few Christmas hymns I didn't mind due to their association with the season.

That's SO different from me. I *loved* church music and still do. I actually feel like I could easily belong to a Black Gospel type church. Think that would be the perfect fit for me. (I've been saying that for stinking years, I should just go and try it).

6. What was your favorite thing about church attendance?

When it was over.

Ugh sorry! I can sort of relate to that but our services weren't three hours long. One hour of SS and one hour of Worship Service. But...I tell you...before the church got AC installed, sitting on those wooden pews in a dress was tough! My friends and I passed notes to each other during the service before we were old enough to appreciate the sermons.

Lisa Simpson had a line I could always relate to (I can only paraphrase): I love getting home from church. It's the longest time right now before we have to go back.

7. What was your least favorite thing about church attendance?

The culture.

8. What was your favorite teaching in church?

I'm sitting here trying to answer your questions as honestly as possible, and this one has stumped me. I can't think of anything I uniquely learned from the Mormon church that I still find valuable.

What I will say is that the church was a good training ground for my career in terms of public speaking experience.

I totally get the public speaking piece! I credit my early experiences in Jr. Choir and our SS Christmas plays with my ability to understand and give cues, to put together a program, ceremony, or lecture that flows well, and be confident speaking in front of a crowd. I'm glad you got something from your church experiences to take into your future. It's really a good feeling to feel that confidence!

9. What was your least favorite teaching in church?

There are too many to list, but I remember the one I found the most offensive as a teenager, the easiest to disbelieve, and the thing that made it easy to leave: the idea of a Judgment Day.

What exactly about Judgment Day? The going to Outer Darkness or Hell for eternity? Or is it that there could be a final judgment at all...for eternity?

10. What do you like on your pizza?

It's true; I love a good Hawaiian.

There's a local pizza joint that makes a special pie called The Stallion. I have no idea what they put on it (some kind of sausage and garlic sauce), but it's divine.

Okay that right there makes you a pizza loser in my eyes. How COULD you put that abject crap on your pizza? Sheesh. You're completely hopeless! Hawaiian. Seriously who does that?

Thanks if you are willing,

Sure. It was fun.

I love doing this with people who are willing! I'd rather do this than any other option I have on this whole board.

Jersey the Liar

I don't think you're a liar, Jersey Girl.

[/quote]

According to that thread you started you think I'm a liar. That's okay. I can live with it. I don't mind being thought of as delusional either.

One more Q for you: Would you self describe as atheist or agnostic? Or what?

[Jersey Girl]

No I'm not done yet! in real life got me going in a different direction so when I posted the past couple of days I did comments that were easy and that I didn't have to think 2 seconds about. Not so with my questions to you.

I'm coming back I promise!

Ask him about his favorite dessert and whether he prefers fast or slow dancing.

Um, you just asked him, Bird.

[Some Schmo]

Do you mind saying where you went when you left home? Did you have a relative to help you out? Feel free to pass on this question if it feels like too much disclosure.

I was already going to be moving in with a friend's family in the summer after graduating high school. I ended up moving in a little earlier than that. I didn't leave home over the church, though. It was more a realization after moving out that I didn't have to subject myself to church any more.

Did you mostly never believe it? If so, do you remember what made your antenna go up? Red flag? What didn't make sense?

I was at a fireside (an extra-curricular church meeting - not sure how else to describe that) and a guy gave a talk on his conversion story. I was about 9 at the time. He talked about hearing the Joseph Smith story for the first time and his reaction was, "You guys actually believe that?" It was the first time I'd ever heard anyone question or mock the story, and I got stuck ruminating on whether I believed it. He went on to say he prayed and received a testimony, but I was stuck on his initial, more relevant first reaction.

Up to that point, I went to church because my family did, and I accepted the stories like I accepted Santa Claus. So yeah, I'd say the seeds of doubt were planted at about age 9.

I think I get that. You didn't like the whole scene that constitutes religion. It was a giant turn off to you. Maybe you felt like it was too confining or that people are hypocrites or something.

The hypocrisy was unbearable. It's not an overt hypocrisy; it's subtle, and it's entirely contained within the show everyone puts on for each other at church gatherings. There is what I felt was a fake niceness about everyone. People always talk about how nice Mormons are. I think it's a veneer.

Just as a matter of sharing, I was infant baptized Presbyterian (Scottish culture) but I was raised up in a non-denomination church but the pastor was schooled at Bob Jones University. I've attended base chapel Protestant and Catholic services. I've been to Lutheran (Catholic lite!), Presbyterian (can't recall what it was like) and I went to a Hindu service for a young man who committed suicide, the son of a co-worker*, I went to show support, I attended memorial services at one Mega Church (don't like those at all) and a Cowboy Church (loved it). Also have been to LDS Ward and Stake--baptism, Traveling Road Show, Ward talent show, a really nice Christmas gathering at the Ward where the members dressed in period clothing from the time of Christ's birth and it was set up sort of like a little village with peddlers and stuff you could sample--food, etc. I can't pick which one of those activities I liked best. I liked them all. I've been to Girl's Activity and did some training support for the LDS Boy Scout troop camping efforts through the local Ward.

*I had visited my coworker at her home and she helped me understand that because her son took his own life that he essentially destroyed his soul and ceased to exist. Schmo, it was SO sad but I knew right there and then I would go to the Hindu service. I'll show up just about anywhere to support a friend.

That's heartbreaking. I'd go too, to be honest. I've sat through a lot of religious services in support of friends and family. Totally understand.

Would you say that you weren't a believer at that point and were just doing what was expected of you by your family and church culture? I was baptized by immersion at age 11 in a neighborhood church in my home town (my own church didn't have a baptismal pool at the time). It was summer and there were June bugs floating in the pool!

I was eight years old and more hyped about a milestone. It was my eighth birthday, which meant I was old enough to get baptized. It wasn't about entering into some covenant for me. It was about growing up. I'm a big boy now.

And I knew it would make people I depended on happy.

Oh, and as far as I remember, the baptismal font where I was dunked was very sanitary. I also remember it being wonderfully warm.

That's SO different from me. I *loved* church music and still do. I actually feel like I could easily belong to a Black Gospel type church. Think that would be the perfect fit for me. (I've been saying that for stinking years, I should just go and try it).

Well, listen, if the services I went to had a band and an African American choir singing gospel tunes, some kind of Sister Act, I think I'd have been all about it. But that's not Mormons. I do love seeing those movies with all the people standing up and clapping along with the rocking gospel music.

I totally get the public speaking piece! I credit my early experiences in Jr. Choir and our SS Christmas plays with my ability to understand and give cues, to put together a program, ceremony, or lecture that flows well, and be confident speaking in front of a crowd. I'm glad you got something from your church experiences to take into your future. It's really a good feeling to feel that confidence!

The biggest thing was getting in front of a large crowd when I was really young and having an accepting, forgiving crowd. I could have stage time for free. I did it enough times growing up that it's never been a fear of mine. Standing in front of people doesn't scare me at all. Being unprepared does, however.

What exactly about Judgment Day? The going to Outer Darkness or Hell for eternity? Or is it that there could be a final judgment at all...for eternity?

It's the idea that we are being tested without a clear definition of the rules. And also, yes, the idea that what you do in an 8 to 100 year lifespan will determine your fate for the rest of eternity. To me, those ideas are simply outrageous, and I'm disappointed anyone might be taken by them.

If someone wants to sell me on being a good person, sell me on the practical, real world benefits of being a good person, and I'll do it. If you threaten me with hellfire and damnation, I'm going to assume you're a charlatan and politely tell you to “F” off, New Jersey style.

Okay that right there makes you a pizza loser in my eyes. How COULD you put that abject crap on your pizza? Sheesh. You're completely hopeless! Hawaiian. Seriously who does that?

I will refer you to the outtakes thread for my overall reaction, which still stands.

by the way, pineapple apparently is really good for helping to rebuild your muscles after a workout. Just saying. Could be a wives tale. Or a wives of guys who work out tale.

I love doing this with people who are willing! I'd rather do this than any other option I have on this whole board.

It was fun for me too. (Who doesn't like talking about themselves?) At the very least, you can get a sense of where I'm coming from.

According to that thread you started you think I'm a liar. That's okay. I can live with it. I don't mind being thought of as delusional either.

I think you say a lot of things that are unverifiable, and that you repeat ideas that are questionable. I don't think you are a liar. I think you are sincere. I just think that religion is built on lies, and so if one is involved in religion, they are part of the cycle.

You strike me as more spiritual than religious.

One more Q for you: Would you self describe as atheist or agnostic? Or what?

I consider myself one who disagrees with people who claim a god exists. People say a god exists. Others believe in several. I simply disagree, primarily because I've never heard a good reason to believe any god exists, nor have I ever heard a believable god described.

So I'm a disagree-er. Disagreeism on the question of theism?

[Some Schmo]

Let me be explicit about something.

Some of the finest people I've met in my life have been members of one church or another. When I said, "lying is the root of all religion" I'm really talking about the culture of religion, and not how people live their day to day lives. Most people have their church life and their real world life, and they kind of separate the two. I would never mean to suggest that religious people are 100% dishonest, because that's crazy. I've met many very honest religious people. I don't think they are consciously lying when they talk about their faith. I just think they are perpetuating a tradition of telling comforting platitudes, often at the expense of the truth.

I'm really talking about the religious content creators, the people who hand down the rules for the various franchises to follow. Those guys are flat out lying, mostly about who they are.

[Jersey Girl]

Schmo thanks for your reply and putting up with my questions! I'll get back on this tomorrow or Sunday. Just right away, I want to tell you that I know what a fireside is. There's not much about the LDS Church that is unfamiliar to me. I

Anyway...yeah. I'll get back here and continue. We've got what feels like 50 thousand irons in the fire right now and it's daunting. We had the hailstorm from literal hell last month (golf balls hitting the house for a solid hour) and are dealing with contractors, bids, odds and ends, etc. But I'll get back here over the weekend!

I really much prefer talking one:one with people in real life and any time I can manage it on this board. For me, it's the best thing I can ever do or experience in both situations. You could write your whole life story here and I'd be totally captivated by it. That goes for any other poster as well. Well most...

[Some Schmo]

Schmo thanks for your reply and putting up with my questions! I'll get back on this tomorrow or Sunday. Just right away, I want to tell you that I know what a fireside is. There's not much about the LDS Church that is unfamiliar to me.

They're good questions.

Anyway...yeah. I'll get back here and continue. We've got what feels like 50 thousand irons in the fire right now and it's daunting. We had the hailstorm from literal hell last month (golf balls hitting the house for a solid hour) and are dealing with contractors, bids, odds and ends, etc. But I'll get back here over the weekend!

Oh man. I hope you escape that with minimal hassle and expense.

I really much prefer talking one:one with people in real life and any time I can manage it on this board. For me, it's the best thing I can ever do or experience in both situations. You could write your whole life story here and I'd be totally captivated by it. That goes for any other poster as well. Well most...

I've met a couple recently, going out to dinner with them on Friday nights (just got back from it a couple hours ago). They're in their 70's, extremely right-wing (he really likes Trump, she doesn't as much but hates Biden), and love to shoot guns at the range regularly. I love hanging with them. They're older, don't put up with crap, and have interesting things to say. I balk at certain opinions, but they're fine with it. We actually agree on most issues, when we get down to the fundamentals. And we enjoy each other's company.

I think not agreeing but finding common ground makes conversations more interesting.