Donald Trump and Joseph Smith

[ajax18]

Joseph Smith came from nothing. He had a very different perspective on wealth redistribution. I'm not saying Joseph was a communist nor that he would have tolerated the "everybody's got to eat," racial justifications for smash and grab robbing of liquor stores in the name of reparations embraced by modern Democrats. Yes Joseph divided property but he was firm in his view that the loafer should not eat the bread earned by the laborer.

In Trump the conservative working class found a man with enough wealth to give them the means to fight back against the communists on the left and the Romney/GWB aristocrats on the right.

[Doctor Steuss]

I'm sorry Ajax, but what has Trump done for the working class? I mean besides talk and make false promises.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features ... on-support

If anything, he's used the gullible working class to sustain him financially. The money is one way, from the working class to Trump.

Just because Trump successfully tapped into the anger of the working class doesn't mean he's done anything for them.

He did way more for us than any of his opponents ever did. Inasmuch as he failed it's because we're in a post constitutional democracy that amounts to nothing more than 3 wolves and a sheep voting on who to eat for dinner. As I said I'll be voting Democrat as part of my scorched earth political initiative. I hope I live to see you working your ass off to pay for these moochers in your old age. That would make it worth it.

Then just give some examples of things that he did for the working class. There was 4 years of legislation (2 of which were buttered with legislative sycophants), and almost as many executive orders during those 4 years as the dictator Obama did in 8 years.

If he did way more than anyone else, it should be pretty easy to fire off solid examples that can't be quibbled about -- y'know, with it being way more and all.

[ajax18]

He did way more for us than any of his opponents ever did. Inasmuch as he failed it's because we're in a post constitutional democracy that amounts to nothing more than 3 wolves and a sheep voting on who to eat for dinner. As I said I'll be voting Democrat as part of my scorched earth political initiative. I hope I live to see you working your ass off to pay for these moochers in your old age. That would make it worth it.

Then just give some examples of things that he did for the working class. There was 4 years of legislation (2 of which were buttered with legislative sycophants), and almost as many executive orders during those 4 years as the dictator Obama did in 8 years.

If he did way more than anyone else, it should be pretty easy to fire off solid examples that can't be quibbled about -- y'know, with it being way more and all.

Remain in Mexico policy for asylum seekers saved taxpayers billions of dollars in addition to elevating wages for legal working American citizens. Granted it cost people like Veritas more in taxes in labor but Veritas is rich enough that he hasn't worked in yeats so I don't consider him to be working class.

Peace through strength was working which saved taxpayers.

Above all the economy, gasoline prices, inflation, was inarguably better for working class in 2019. If you lived off welfare handouts maybe from COVID scamdemic stimulus than maybe Bidenomics was better but I don't consider welfare people to be working class.

[Doctor Steuss]

[...] gasoline prices [...]

This one in particular cracks me up every time people preen about it, while fondly remembering the god-emperor's reign. It's such a great example of how little people actually understand short-term gain, and long-term consequences. It also demonstrates how the relationship between supply and demand is a mysterious phantom to some that is beyond comprehension.

Trump absolutely demolished our domestic oil production, bankrupted a huge swath of small oil businesses, and sabotaged our energy security. But hey, we had low gas prices for a little while, so that's, like, good or something. I'm sure reflecting on those unsustainable temporary low gas prices is of great comfort to all of the middle class people whose lives and businesses were destroyed.

We still haven't fully recovered the domestic oil refining capacity we lost under Trump. Incidentally, under Biden, our domestic oil production is back to record levels (it's almost as if status-quo neo-liberal corporatists aren't the leftists that right-wing outrage porn demands them to be).

By the way: Care to guess what our corporate oil subsides looked like under Trump? I'll give you a hint... it made Russia look like a laze fair capitalist utopia. But socialism is bad, unless it's Trump or DeSantis doing it... or something.

[ajax18]

[...] gasoline prices [...]

This one in particular cracks me up every time people preen about it, while fondly remembering the god-emperor's reign. It's such a great example of how little people actually understand short-term gain, and long-term consequences. It also demonstrates how the relationship between supply and demand is a mysterious phantom to some that is beyond comprehension.

Trump absolutely demolished our domestic oil production, bankrupted a huge swath of small oil businesses, and sabotaged our energy security. But hey, we had low gas prices for a little while, so that's, like, good or something. I'm sure reflecting on those unsustainable temporary low gas prices is of great comfort to all of the middle class people whose lives and businesses were destroyed.

We still haven't fully recovered the domestic oil refining capacity we lost under Trump. Incidentally, under Biden, our domestic oil production is back to record levels (it's almost as if status-quo neo-liberal corporatists aren't the leftists that right-wing outrage porn demands them to be).

By the way: Care to guess what our corporate oil subsides looked like under Trump? I'll give you a hint... it made Russia look like a laze fair capitalist utopia. But socialism is bad, unless it's Trump or DeSantis doing it... or something.

At least you're not advocating a nonglobal climate change sacrifice of the US economy and American standard of living that will not even prevent global warming. Emptying the strategic petroleum reserve to save the 2022 midterms wasn't a win for working Americans. It's running out and gasoline prices are back on the rise.

[Doctor Steuss]

At least you're not advocating a nonglobal climate change sacrifice of the US economy and American standard of living that will not even prevent global warming. Emptying the strategic petroleum reserve to save the 2022 midterms wasn't a win for working Americans. It's running out and gasoline prices are back on the rise.

Yep, emptying the oil reserves to try to pad the fallout from one small aspect of Trump's incompetence and short-sightedness was likely not the best move. We're now around where the reserves were under Reagan.

What's really wild about the gas prices right now, is looking at the wholesale market price compared to the retail price at the pump. The retail pump price has increased exponentially compared to the market price. Too bad that when legislation was drafted to prevent this type of price-gouging, and protect the middle class, it was blocked entirely (and solely) by Trumpists.

The price at the pump here went up about $1.20/gal over the course of 8 days. During that same time, the market price went up $0.14/gal.

Trump and his political acolytes help the middle class when it benefits them as individuals. It's an unintentional byproduct, not a goal. And Trumpist politicians will keep on winning, because they know how to tap into the (very well justified) anger of the uneducated in the US. There was a recent report showing the difference between life expectancy, disease, and a myriad of other factors in the US for people with a BA (or above), and those without. The uneducated in the US generally have life outcomes on par with many third world countries, and those self-same people will keep voting against their own interests because they are (rightfully) pissed, and Trumpists know how to weaponize that anger for their own personal gain.

[ajax18]

At least you're not advocating a nonglobal climate change sacrifice of the US economy and American standard of living that will not even prevent global warming. Emptying the strategic petroleum reserve to save the 2022 midterms wasn't a win for working Americans. It's running out and gasoline prices are back on the rise.

Yep, emptying the oil reserves to try to pad the fallout from one small aspect of Trump's incompetence and short-sightedness was likely not the best move. We're now around where the reserves were under Reagan.

What's really wild about the gas prices right now, is looking at the wholesale market price compared to the retail price at the pump. The retail pump price has increased exponentially compared to the market price. Too bad that when legislation was drafted to prevent this type of price-gouging, and protect the middle class, it was blocked entirely (and solely) by Trumpists.

The price at the pump here went up about $1.20/gal over the course of 8 days. During that same time, the market price went up $0.14/gal.

Trump and his political acolytes help the middle class when it benefits them as individuals. It's an unintentional byproduct, not a goal. And Trumpist politicians will keep on winning, because they know how to tap into the (very well justified) anger of the uneducated in the US. There was a recent report showing the difference between life expectancy, disease, and a myriad of other factors in the US for people with a BA (or above), and those without. The uneducated in the US generally have life outcomes on par with many third world countries, and those self-same people will keep voting against their own interests because they are (rightfully) pissed, and Trumpists know how to weaponize that anger for their own personal gain.

Are you saying that companies went from being benevolent law biding businessmen during the Trump Administration to price gougers upon the election of Joe Biden? And what do you mean they'll continue to vote for Trumpists? Self reliant hard working people are a minority. Democracy seems to favor communism most of the time. Democracy chooses unsustainable debt. And how can you not look around you and see what the results have been? How much do groceries cost working families? Honestly it doesn't really matter to me what gasoline prices are. I still eat beef nearly every day. And while I spend my life at work dealing with the dregs of society, I've been able to afford it but there are many hard working people below me who have not. And that ugly economic truth falls squarely upon those who voted for Joe Biden in 2020 and the Democrat party in 2022. The American people chose this and now they're going to continue to suffer for it long after they realize what a mistake they made.

[Gadianton]

Remain in Mexico policy for asylum seekers saved taxpayers billions of dollars in addition to elevating wages for legal working American citizens.

CFR -- show the economic study proving this. 70,000 Mexicans deported somehow equated to billions and a discernable increase in standard of living for American workers? I call BS.

Above all the economy, gasoline prices, inflation, was inarguably better for working class in 2019.

You haven't allowed for Trump's trade war with China and subsequently, Republican Jerome Powell's interest rates cuts to take their toll. There was a brief boon as the roller coaster dropped to zero. Then what? Once interest rates are near zero, there's only one direction they can go from there -- dumb ass.

If you lived off welfare handouts maybe from COVID scamdemic stimulus

The first stimulus was signed by Donald J. Trump, dumb ass. He didn't fight it. If you were a RINO, you could say that republicans fought for lower COVID spending, but a Trump supporter can't make that claim.

There were cracks in the foundation back in 2017 and 2018 that had nothing to do with who was president. In particular, labor for home building was drying up. Why? I don't fully know. Some of it was retirement (boomers), some was immigration policy, a little more seems to have been shifting preferences for millennials who prefer other kinds of non-skilled labor to entry level construction. We were already on a bad path for a housing shortage prior to supply chain disruptions from COVID.

Aside from who is president, we're in a world decoupling trade (beginning with Trump) and declining birth rates, the retirement scam that basically benefited 1.5 generations in the history of the world is over -- trickle-down economics gave all of our wealth to the boomers and a few billionaires like Bill Gates who you apparently worship -- who will live large until they reach end of life and then it will all cancel out in memory care costs.

Wealth is relative, it isn't a dollar figure. I don't know how you expect to retire if there are only .7 workers in the workforce for each retiree that must be supported. How does that work, Ajax? So you're right, I may well be working until I'm 90. I pace myself. Donald Trump kicking out Mexicans and becoming a dictator, and Matt Gaetz shutting down the government isn't going to provide a retirement for me.

[ajax18]

CFR -- show the economic study proving this. 70,000 Mexicans deported somehow equated to billions and a discernable increase in standard of living for American workers? I call BS.

That's just it. We didn't have to deport them. We didn't have to search for them. We didn't have to endure enormous court costs, shelter them, feed them, or have them stealing from us if we didn't if we had them stay in Mexico while they waited for their asylum case to be heard.

Republican Jerome Powell's interest rates cuts to take their toll.

Oh please Jerome Powell is no conservative. The fact that the interest rates depend on some unelected bureaucret was never true laisee faire free market capitalism.

The first stimulus was signed by Donald J. Trump, dumb ass.

After being crucified by the media, Donald Trump made some poor decisions during the scamdemic, not the least of which was awarding Toni Fauci a medal of freedom in spite of his funding of "Gain of function research," and lying to Congress about it. The left more than likely colluded with China to bring about the global scamdemic once they realized they couldn't get rid of Trump through the first impeachment. The economic destruction they brought this world through the politics of fear was intentional. You destroyed the world economy to overturn an election you didn't like. Now the vast majority of America will endure the cost of it while only a few globalist oligarchs control the rest along with their partners in the CCP.

There were cracks in the foundation back in 2017 and 2018 that had nothing to do with who was president. In particular, labor for home building was drying up. Why? I don't fully know.

Why work when you can pull a check?

Aside from who is president, we're in a world decoupling trade (beginning with Trump) and declining birth rates,

There's no shortage of poor and irresponsible people having kids. What we lack are people of faith who are willing to sacrifice and actually put the time and effort into raising strong and capable kids.

the retirement scam that basically benefited 1.5 generations in the history of the world is over

We're still paying the price for the bad decisions made under LBJ's great society. You can only kick the can down the road for so long.

-- trickle-down economics gave all of our wealth to the boomers

Trickle down? How so?

and a few billionaires like Bill Gates who you apparently worship

What the hell would make you think I like Bill Gates? He's a globalist oligarch trying to seize our ranches and farmland, literally taking the steak off my table and my truck out of my driveway.

-- who will live large until they reach end of life and then it will all cancel out in memory care costs.

That's about right.

I don't know how you expect to retire if there are only .7 workers in the workforce for each retiree that must be supported.

I don't think any of us should be retiring. I'll be working to help my children and grandchildren until I collapse just as my parents have done for me. Perhaps Biden and Feinstein do have redeeming qualities in this, if you consider selling political favors to foreign governments around the world until you can barely put two sentences together to be "taking care of your family." Do you not believe that it's people like Hunter Biden who are behind this elder abuse going on in Washington? Hell no Dad can't retire, I might lose my seat on the board at Burisma!

So you're right, I may well be working until I'm 90. I pace myself.

You know Gad, I admire that part about you. I hope you can someday leave your children a fortune. I think you could work until you're 100 because you have the will and strength to do it. I just wish that after you turn 68 you didn't have to continue paying taxes to the same deadbeats you paid for during the first 30 years of your career.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Close enough?



- Doc