We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

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Vēritās
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Re: We Need More Immigrants not Fewer

Post by Vēritās »

ajax18 wrote:
Sat Jan 27, 2024 10:29 pm
The border has been "enforced" every day Biden was President. It was never "open" no matter how many times you people keep lying about it.
Which makes Joe Biden's promise to shut the border down in exchange for more work permits and legal immigration an empty promise.
You're not making any sense and every point you think you've made has been refuted. Just face it. All you're left with is squirmy lies, and Biden owned you and your entire cult by calling your bluff. We have Republicans admitting they won't pass the legislation ONLY BECAUSE it would help Biden, and we have other Republicans admitting Donald Trump urged Congress to give him this authority back in 2017 but he didn't get it. That's the reason Trump never once "shut down the border." All he did was waste tax payer money on a fragment of his vanity project that never had any hope of preventing illegal immigration.

The fact is the whole "Open Border" is just a right wing myth based on disinformation, lies and ignorance. This is from the CATO Institute:

Biden’s Border Policy Is Not “Open Borders”
President Biden has not suddenly ended America’s immigration prohibition and opened up U.S. borders to almost anyone who wants to come (as was largely America’s immigration policy from 1776 to 1924). Instead, he has far more vigorously enforced immigration prohibition than the law requires, narrowing the few exceptions to the universal ban on legal immigration.

For example, one exception is for those facing persecution in their home countries. Biden has undisputed authority under the law to admit as many refugees from abroad as he wants. The president sets the limit and picks whoever he considers “of concern” to the United States. Yet Biden is on pace to admit the fewest refugees in the history of the U.S. refugee program, fewer than 10,000.

He won’t let refugees in from abroad. But the law explicitly allows refugees to ask for asylum at U.S. borders even if they don’t have permission: anyone “who arrives in the United States (whether or not at a designated port of arrival … ), irrespective of [their legal] status, may apply for asylum.” In 1996, Congress clarified that agents “shall refer [any asylum seeker] for an interview by an asylum officer.”

Yet Biden won’t follow that either. He has continued a Trump ban on “nonessential travel” at U.S. land ports of entry and requesting asylum isn’t essential. So because they can’t come in legally, they cross illegally, and since the law says they can apply “whether or not at a designated port of entry, irrespective of their legal status,” they should still have the right to request asylum.

But Biden is using another Trump policy known as “Title 42 expulsion” to immediately deport as many asylum seekers and border crossers as possible without hearing their asylum claims. He’s mostly dumping them in Mexico, just as Trump did with “Remain in Mexico,” just with a different name and on a much larger scale. Biden’s still using the pandemic as a reason for this policy, despite the easy availability of effective vaccines for Americans who want them. But whatever the excuse, his goal is the same as Trump: immediately deport as many as he possibly can.

So what explains the reports of some immigrants being released into the United States? Is this “open borders”? Not at all. The numbers of arrivals so far exceed the government’s capacity to turn them away that it has resorted to releasing a few of them as a last resort, but they are not “free.” They are arrested, detained, and charged as removable. They are illegal immigrants subject to re‐​arrest at any time.

The Biden administration has smashed all records for immediate expulsions without due process, increasing the rate from 62,000 per month under Trump to about 100,000, but Mexico will only take back its own citizens, Guatemalans, Hondurans, and Salvadorans, and even for the Central Americans, it will not take back young kids with their parents if it has no place for them to stay (how logical!).

So everyone else must be put on planes and flown back, but this takes far more time and resources than the government has. Immigrants must be detained, checked over much more thoroughly, and shipped to airports. There aren’t enough detention facilities, agents, and airplanes to get this job done in enough time to avoid having to release some immigrants. The Biden administration has repeatedly said as much.

Don’t believe them? Well, the Trump administration faced the exact same constraints, and they too released many thousands of immigrants from the border. But Biden has a much greater challenge now to keep up his closed border policies. The number of immigrants arriving from outside Mexico and Central America has exploded in the last few months, increasing from about 10,000 to more than 62,000 per month, requiring farther flights and more resources. Yet despite the releases, the number of removals or those sent to immigration jail far outnumber the number of releases about 3 to 1.

The illegal immigration problem would disappear if President Biden would simply let immigrants enter the country legally at ports of entry to request asylum, grant them work visas at consulates, or admit them from abroad under the refugee program or through “humanitarian parole”—a discretionary legal immigration authority that he has chosen only to deploy sparingly, mainly for Afghans. Yet Biden is keeping consulates closed and wasting more than 42,000 H‑2B seasonal work visas that Congress authorized him to issue.

Ultimately, Biden has made a policy choice to let in as few immigrants as possible. He’s not simply “enforcing the law.” He’s finding every way possible to keep out immigrants. Yet despite this fact, he’s still facing the same tired claims that he’s for “open borders.” If he’s going to get that claim regardless, he should just own it. Open America’s doors, and let immigrants come legally.
"I am not an American ... In my view premarital sex should be illegal ...(there are) mentally challenged people with special needs like myself- Ajax18
Vēritās
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Re: We Need More Immigrants not Fewer

Post by Vēritās »

Apprehensions and Expulsions

(3.9 million during Biden's first 2 years)

2022 - 2,214,652
2021 - 1,662,167

2020 - 404,036
2019 - 859,501
2018 - 404,142
2017 - 310,513

Joe Biden has doubled the number of expulsions Trump oversaw, in half the time.

How does this jive with the BS claim of "open borders"?
"I am not an American ... In my view premarital sex should be illegal ...(there are) mentally challenged people with special needs like myself- Ajax18
Gunnar
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Re: We Need More Immigrants not Fewer

Post by Gunnar »

Vēritās wrote:
Sun Jan 28, 2024 6:05 am
Apprehensions and Expulsions

(3.9 million during Biden's first 2 years)

2022 - 2,214,652
2021 - 1,662,167

2020 - 404,036
2019 - 859,501
2018 - 404,142
2017 - 310,513

Joe Biden has doubled the number of expulsions Trump oversaw, in half the time.

How does this jive with the BS claim of "open borders"?
Not only that, how does the higher than ever success in detecting and intercepting dangerous drugs like fentanyl at our borders jive with the claim of "open borders?" Either we are doing a better job than ever of detecting the smuggling of fentanyl at the borders or we have open borders. Both cannot be true at the same time!
No precept or claim is more suspect or more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.
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ajax18
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Re: We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

Post by ajax18 »

That's the reason Trump never once "shut down the border."
Didn't you say at the time it was because Trump was a closet liberal who wouldn't keep his campaign promises to his base?
All he did was waste tax payer money on a fragment of his vanity project that never had any hope of preventing illegal immigration.
Because Nancy Pelosi refused to fund it. She said walls were immoral, which is the reason Democrats never have nor ever will enforce the border, but only facilitate and process more illegal immigrants for citizenship. That's why they demand illegal immigrants be called undocumented, because no human being is illegal, regardless of what democratically elected officials say or even the majority says.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
Schreech
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Re: We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

Post by Schreech »

ajax18 wrote:
Sun Jan 28, 2024 12:26 pm
…Because Nancy Pelosi refused to fund it…
"I would build a great wall, and nobody builds walls better than me, believe me, and I’ll build them very inexpensively. I will build a great great wall on our southern border and I’ll have Mexico pay for that wall."

https://fortune.com/2018/12/13/trump-me ... -wall/amp/

It’s hilarious that even gullible double cultists like yourself didn’t believe trumps lies about getting the wall built. You have to concoct stories blaming one of your librul boogeymen to somehow let your mushroom-dicked wannabe dictator off the hook.
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Gadianton
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Re: We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

Post by Gadianton »

Hey Ajax,

If I say, "I can build the fastest car in the world; I'm the best hypercar builder. Nobody builds hypercars better than I do and I'll build them cheaply."

You'll believe me, right? And then when I build a half-completed POS, you'll defend me saying, "...because his investors wouldn't give him the money for it."

Part of making grandiose claims that require lots of funding is being able to secure the funding.
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Bret Ripley
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Re: We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

Post by Bret Ripley »

ajax18 wrote:
Sun Jan 28, 2024 12:26 pm
... Democrats never have nor ever will enforce the border
Veritas wrote:Apprehensions and Expulsions

(3.9 million during Biden's first 2 years)

2022 - 2,214,652
2021 - 1,662,167

2020 - 404,036
2019 - 859,501
2018 - 404,142
2017 - 310,513

Joe Biden has doubled the number of expulsions Trump oversaw, in half the time.
ajax18 wrote:Image

... Democrats never have nor ever will enforce the border
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ajax18
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Re: We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

Post by ajax18 »

The numbers of arrivals so far exceed the government’s capacity to turn them away that it has resorted to releasing a few of them as a last resort,
Why do we have to fly central American illegal immigrants anywhere? If they made their way to Mexico, than Mexico needs to figure out a way to deport them or stop them from setting foot in Mexico. The Biden Administration and big corporations simply detest working class Americans and are looking to replace them with people who are willing to work for less.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
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Re: We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

Post by Chap »

ajax18 wrote:
Sun Jan 28, 2024 5:51 pm
The numbers of arrivals so far exceed the government’s capacity to turn them away that it has resorted to releasing a few of them as a last resort,
Why do we have to fly central American illegal immigrants anywhere? If they made their way to Mexico, than Mexico needs to figure out a way to deport them or stop them from setting foot in Mexico. The Biden Administration and big corporations simply detest working class Americans and are looking to replace them with people who are willing to work for less.
I realise that you don't find these things easy, but please could you learn to use the "Quote" feature properly, so we can see who it is you are quoting? As it is, we have no idea who you want us to believe said that stuff about "The numbers of arrivals so far exceed the government’s capacity to turn them away that it has resorted to releasing a few of them as a last resort".

As a result, the impact of your quote is reduced to approximately zero.

Oh, by the way, do you agree that the Biden administration has doubled the number of expulsions Trump oversaw, in half the time? I notice that you do not dispute that fact. If so, why do you keep criticising Biden's border policy? He is being a lot more effective than Trump, isn't he? I am surprised that you are not pleased about that.
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ajax18
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Re: We Need More Immigrants, not Fewer

Post by ajax18 »

Chap wrote:
If so, why do you keep criticising Biden's border policy? He is being a lot more effective than Trump, isn't he?
Effective border policy would have been remain in Mexico that Biden rescinded on his first day of office. Effective border enforcement is not seeing 6 million illegal immigrants (that we know about) enter the country. Just because policemen are making more arrests doesn't mean the border is being enforced. The border is being enforced when there are no illegal immigrants in the country, period! And this could have been done long ago. It should have been done long ago according to democratic established law. But once again we see our government is controlled by big corporations, big government, and big money, not the American citizen.

Veritas's entire argument is so ridiculous. First he points out what he really believes which is that we need more unskilled labor imported from the 3rd world. This is not a merit based immigration system but rather based on who is willing to break the law and invade the country. After suing Arizona, Texas, and fighting President Trump at every turn to keep the border open and unenforced, they try to tell us that they'll "shut down" the border if we just sign away the American taxpayer to more debt for Ukraine, even though they are campaigning on the idea that border enforcement is racist and immoral.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
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