Mormonism's Inflated Sense of Self-Importance

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
_Jason Bourne
_Emeritus
Posts: 9207
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:00 pm

Post by _Jason Bourne »

KimberlyAnn wrote:One thing I find particularly offensive about Mormon theology is Baptism for the Dead. Why do members think it appropriate to baptize folks who repeatedly refused to become Mormons when they were living? It seems nothing short of rude. I've friends and neighbors who are just chomping at the bit to posthumously baptize family members who have steadfastly refused all attempts to be converted to Mormonism! To presume that those folks, many of them careful followers of their own religions, would want to be made dead members of the Mormon church is not only absurd, it's arrogant!

.

KA


Is is interesting. What you find offensive others find wonderful. Even some of other faith;s have commented that LDS doctrine on this topic provides a beautiful way to reach out to deceased ancestors that may have been beyond salvations grasp. For believing Mormons it gives great comfort that they can be part of the salvation of those who never had the chance to hear the good word.

Oh, one other point. Your rezoning is flawed. The baptisms are mostly not for those who repeatedly refused to become Mormons. Oh sure maybe a child may be baptized for a parent who never joined, or grandparent. But mostly it is for those who never would have heard the good word.

A few years ago my brother in law lost his wife. He is not very religous. She was somewhat and she talked some to my wife here and there about the Church but never really pursued it seriously. about a year after she dies my wife asked her brother if he would be offended if she was baptized in her name and she explained how it worked. He was not offended in the least and said he thought it was a wonderful thing and was honored that my wife cared enough to do something like this for her.

As I said, it is all perspective. I find your posting interesting though. It seems everything about the LDS Church offends you. Is there nothing good you find in it?
_MishMagnet
_Emeritus
Posts: 288
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 2:04 pm

Post by _MishMagnet »

I don't recall ever feeling wowed that I was a daughter of God. In my real life I'm one of 8 children and know how little of my parents attention I got in that situation. Much less being one of 30Billion or whatever. Much like Heber C Kimball and his hundreds of offspring I just assumed God probably recognized me but didn't know my name.
Insert ironic quote from fellow board member here.
_The Nehor
_Emeritus
Posts: 11832
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:05 am

Post by _The Nehor »

Trinity wrote:You're a god according to Mormon doctrine. A cute little god-in-training, full of divinity. This really appeals to people who have an ounce of ambition in their body. Godly ambition, godly guilt (when one falls short of their goals), godly arrogance if one needs to amp up their self esteem.

Anyone who has been through the temple has been informed of their god/goddesshood. There is really no amount of humility that erases the fact these people assume they are going to be gods in the next life if they live according to their belief system.


Why would humility erase that fact? Jesus went around claiming to be the literal Savior of the World and the only begotten of the Father yet he is remembered by most as humble.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics
"I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
_barrelomonkeys
_Emeritus
Posts: 3004
Joined: Sat Jun 09, 2007 7:00 pm

Post by _barrelomonkeys »

I wonder if the belief in God, and how the LDS Church teaches God to young people, helps some through their struggles? Perhaps counters the sense that they're insignificant? I could see how this may appeal to some people.

So perhaps the Church is insignificant. Yet, if it helps members feel loved, special, significant, and worthwhile surely this is something that is not such a terrible waste?
_Jason Bourne
_Emeritus
Posts: 9207
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:00 pm

Post by _Jason Bourne »

msnobody wrote:
Gazelam wrote:Kim,

If a person has heard the gospel properly taught, and still rejects it, then a baptism by proxy once they have died is a complete and total waste of time.

After reading your answers to the twelve questions, I have to ask, what in your view is the purpose of life as seen through the eyes of your goddess? ; )

What is necessary to enter her presence in the world to come?

That's the catch, Gaz. In the TBM's eyes, baptism for the dead cannot be a total waste of time because if the person didn't accept Mormonism in this life, they couldn't have possibly been taught Old Joe's gospel properly.


No. your statement is flawed.
_SatanWasSetUp
_Emeritus
Posts: 1183
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 2:40 pm

Post by _SatanWasSetUp »

KimberlyAnn wrote:One thing I find particularly offensive about Mormon theology is Baptism for the Dead. Why do members think it appropriate to baptize folks who repeatedly refused to become Mormons when they were living? It seems nothing short of rude. I've friends and neighbors who are just chomping at the bit to posthumously baptize family members who have steadfastly refused all attempts to be converted to Mormonism! To presume that those folks, many of them careful followers of their own religions, would want to be made dead members of the Mormon church is not only absurd, it's arrogant!
KA


There's an old missionary joke when you meet heavy resistence in a particular area, "We should burn it down and do baptisms for the dead." It's funny in a sick sort of way, and it fits the idea that to be baptized into the church is more important than life itself.
"We of this Church do not rely on any man-made statement concerning the nature of Deity. Our knowledge comes directly from the personal experience of Joseph Smith." - Gordon B. Hinckley

"It's wrong to criticize leaders of the Mormon Church even if the criticism is true." - Dallin H. Oaks
_The Nehor
_Emeritus
Posts: 11832
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:05 am

Post by _The Nehor »

SatanWasSetUp wrote:
KimberlyAnn wrote:One thing I find particularly offensive about Mormon theology is Baptism for the Dead. Why do members think it appropriate to baptize folks who repeatedly refused to become Mormons when they were living? It seems nothing short of rude. I've friends and neighbors who are just chomping at the bit to posthumously baptize family members who have steadfastly refused all attempts to be converted to Mormonism! To presume that those folks, many of them careful followers of their own religions, would want to be made dead members of the Mormon church is not only absurd, it's arrogant!
KA


There's an old missionary joke when you meet heavy resistence in a particular area, "We should burn it down and do baptisms for the dead." It's funny in a sick sort of way, and it fits the idea that to be baptized into the church is more important than life itself.


Not more important, equal in the sense that you need both.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics
"I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
_TAK
_Emeritus
Posts: 1555
Joined: Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:47 pm

Post by _TAK »

MishMagnet wrote:I don't recall ever feeling wowed that I was a daughter of God. In my real life I'm one of 8 children and know how little of my parents attention I got in that situation. Much less being one of 30Billion or whatever. Much like Heber C Kimball and his hundreds of offspring I just assumed God probably recognized me but didn't know my name.



30 Billion? Closer to 100 BLN but regardless.. such a small percentage of the people who have lived on this earth have heard of Joseph Smith or the Book of Mormon, if this was God's plan, then it is a major clusterf***...
_mentalgymnast

Post by _mentalgymnast »

Trinity wrote:You're a god according to Mormon doctrine. A cute little god-in-training, full of divinity. This really appeals to people who have an ounce of ambition in their body...Anyone who has been through the temple has been informed of their god/goddesshood. There is really no amount of humility that erases the fact these people assume they are going to be gods in the next life if they live according to their belief system.


Might be better than harps.

Regards,
MG
_LifeOnaPlate
_Emeritus
Posts: 2799
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2007 4:50 pm

Post by _LifeOnaPlate »

One thing I've noticed is the stunning humility exhibited by all former Mormons. Just wanted to toss that in.
One moment in annihilation's waste,
one moment, of the well of life to taste-
The stars are setting and the caravan
starts for the dawn of nothing; Oh, make haste!

-Omar Khayaam

*Be on the lookout for the forthcoming album from Jiminy Finn and the Moneydiggers.*
Post Reply