amantha wrote:The truth that I find useful is that everything that Charity argues for is purely based on her false "spiritual witness."
It is the height of hubris to trust yourself enough to believe that God has definitively spoken to you. You have no way of knowing whether or not your senses are interpreting the incoming data (the spiritual witness) correctly. To say that you cannot possibly be wrong about your interpretation of any experience is to deify yourself.
ALL truth is useful, that is the very nature of truth. We wouldn't call it truth unless it had the capacity to guide our decision making processes--which is useful.
The real question is: Do you know truth when you see it? Who can say for sure except through the usefulness of that truth?
Is it true that a human being can trust herself to know that a god has spoken to her? No.
I would say it equals the hubris that reason will lead to the correct answer.
What is the "correct "answer?
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I may be going to hell in a bucket, babe / But at least I'm enjoying the ride.
-Grateful Dead (lyrics by John Perry Barlow)
DonBradley wrote:It is not the sight of an individual, but rather the pattern of their behavior, that is the basis for a psychological diagnosis or categorization. And thousands of instances of participation in discussion over a period of years might well provide quite sufficient basis for such categorization.
Don
Don,
Would you feel happy about someone "diagnosing" your personality only from what you've posted online?
It is the height of hubris to trust yourself enough to believe that God has definitively spoken to you. You have no way of knowing whether or not your senses are interpreting the incoming data (the spiritual witness) correctly. To say that you cannot possibly be wrong about your interpretation of any experience is to deify yourself.
That has got to be the single most blindly ignorant post ever typed.
Exactly how many testimonies or witnesess do you need, that all edify one another, to understand how the Holy Ghost works? All Mormon missionaries do is go around teaching people how to receive a witness of the Spirit. Thousands of people are baptised every year because they receive an answer to their prayers by the power of the Holy Ghost. This isn't some chemical reaction brought on by wishful thinking, this is no illusion of an oasis in the desert, it is a real and honest responce by God to an earnest prayer.
Even those on this board who have left the Church will testify of it.
Pack up your things and come back when you have something intelligent to offer.
Last edited by Steeler [Crawler] on Sun Jan 13, 2008 3:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato
The Nehor wrote:I would say it equals the hubris that reason will lead to the correct answer.
Religious experience would only lead in the direction of truth if rationally interpreted. And it is decidedly not rational to believe that if something makes me feel good or at peace, it is therefore true, or that my religious experience means my faith is true, while the religious experience of others--e.g., Catholics visited by Mary, evangelicals healed by faith, pentecostals speaking in tongues, and Mormon fundamentalists inspired to follow Warren Jeffs--doesn't similarly mean that their faith is true.
Don
Last edited by Guest on Sun Jan 13, 2008 3:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Nehor wrote:I would say it equals the hubris that reason will lead to the correct answer.
Religious experience would only lead in the direction of truth if rationally interpreted. And it is decidedly not rational to believe that if something makes me feel good or at peace, it is therefore true, or that my religious experience means my faith is true, while the religious experience of others--e.g., Catholics visited by Mary, evangelicals healed by faith, pentecostals speaking in tongues, and Mormon fundamentalists inspired to follow Warren Jeffs--doesn't similarly mean that their faith is true.
Don
Will you please prove this without resorting to reason?
Yeah, but as I have said here I have a lot more to go on then feeling good or feeling at peace.....there is the whole talking to God thing and having him talk back.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
amantha wrote:The truth that I find useful is that everything that Charity argues for is purely based on her false "spiritual witness."
It is the height of hubris to trust yourself enough to believe that God has definitively spoken to you. You have no way of knowing whether or not your senses are interpreting the incoming data (the spiritual witness) correctly. To say that you cannot possibly be wrong about your interpretation of any experience is to deify yourself.
ALL truth is useful, that is the very nature of truth. We wouldn't call it truth unless it had the capacity to guide our decision making processes--which is useful.
The real question is: Do you know truth when you see it? Who can say for sure except through the usefulness of that truth?
Is it true that a human being can trust herself to know that a god has spoken to her? No.
I would say it equals the hubris that reason will lead to the correct answer.
What is the "correct "answer?
Knowledge of anything.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
Once youve tasted the Holy Ghost, you can tell the difference between human emotion and divine influence. The same as you can tell the difference between sugar and salt.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato