Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

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_Gadianton
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Gadianton »

Also, I wonder if there are other "gentile" scholars I am overlooking---i.e., people who have been befriended by the apologists in an effort to bring more credibility to FARMS.


I mentioned David Waltz in another recent thread. He has one review in FROB, and was an avid poster on ZLMB. He was Catholic and really got the praise heaped on him from the apologists. He always seemed ready to go to bat for Mormonism.

Make no mistake though, he was Catholic, and not afraid to raise questions where Mormonism conflicted with his faith. I remember one time, he posted a fascinating thread comparing the acheivements of GBH with Pope John Paul II. GBH came out looking like a fool, and the apologists essentially got owned in that thread.

I also remember him complaining about the apologists too easily siding with atheists when it was convenient to criticize the Bible or other elements of evangelical Christianity. I think he had a more ecumenical vision of faith in general, where the apologists seemed just opportunistic to support their own immediate causes when befriending outsiders.

Anyway, given how well received he was, I wondered if his fleeting role of "gentile apologist" had something to do with the "one way" kind of friendship realized when mingling with apologists. Then again, perhaps it was just a matter of both parties having other things to do.
Lou Midgley 08/20/2020: "...meat wad," and "cockroach" are pithy descriptions of human beings used by gemli? They were not fashioned by Professor Peterson.

LM 11/23/2018: one can explain away the soul of human beings...as...a Meat Unit, to use Professor Peterson's clever derogatory description of gemli's ideology.
_Mister Scratch
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Mister Scratch »

Gadianton wrote:I mentioned David Waltz in another recent thread. He has one review in FROB, and was an avid poster on ZLMB. He was Catholic and really got the praise heaped on him from the apologists. He always seemed ready to go to bat for Mormonism.

Make no mistake though, he was Catholic, and not afraid to raise questions where Mormonism conflicted with his faith. I remember one time, he posted a fascinating thread comparing the acheivements of GBH with Pope John Paul II. GBH came out looking like a fool, and the apologists essentially got owned in that thread.


Fascinating. I knew your scholarly acumen would come in handy here, Dr. Robbers. Can you recall whether or not Waltz was thrown under the bus for this behavior?
_bcspace
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _bcspace »

How do the reptilians figure into this plot?


They're as nonexistent as the notion of chapel vs. internet Mormons.
Machina Sublime
Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
Your Best Resource On Joseph Smith's Polygamy.
Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
_Daniel Peterson
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Daniel Peterson »

Mister Scratch wrote:Dr. Robbers highlighted a very important Mopologetic tactical strategy

Mister Scratch slavishly praises Gadianton Scratch.

Mister Scratch wrote:the pages of FARMS Review are littered with mean-spirited attacks on articles, books, and other texts written by Chapel Mormons.

Don't forget to mention our vicious assaults on leprechauns and unicorns!

Our unparalleled nastiness is on display, in full, at

http://farms.BYU.edu/publications/review/

*** Silly, malevolent, agenda-driven Scratchist nonsense omitted ***

Mister Scratch wrote:Fascinating. I knew your scholarly acumen would come in handy here, Dr. Robbers.

Mister Scratch slavishly praises Gadianton Scratch again.

How exciting.
_Gadianton
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Gadianton »

Fascinating. I knew your scholarly acumen would come in handy here, Dr. Robbers. Can you recall whether or not Waltz was thrown under the bus for this behavior?


I don't think this can be proven. I do believe the proposition though is both possible and rational. I'm not going to say it's my theory, I think it's a theory with some merit.

I think given this incident and others like it, that there grew to be some mutual dissatisfaction, even though I would still call the relationship friendly.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:38 am, edited 2 times in total.
Lou Midgley 08/20/2020: "...meat wad," and "cockroach" are pithy descriptions of human beings used by gemli? They were not fashioned by Professor Peterson.

LM 11/23/2018: one can explain away the soul of human beings...as...a Meat Unit, to use Professor Peterson's clever derogatory description of gemli's ideology.
_Daniel Peterson
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Daniel Peterson »

Gadianton Scratch wrote:I think given this incident and others like it, that there grew to be mutual disatisfaction.

I'm unaware of any dissatisfaction with David Waltz.

-the apologists (a.k.a. "Daniel Peterson")
_Gadianton
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Gadianton »

It's very possible you are right.

I am curious though, when is the last time the Review has solicited material from him?
Lou Midgley 08/20/2020: "...meat wad," and "cockroach" are pithy descriptions of human beings used by gemli? They were not fashioned by Professor Peterson.

LM 11/23/2018: one can explain away the soul of human beings...as...a Meat Unit, to use Professor Peterson's clever derogatory description of gemli's ideology.
_Daniel Peterson
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Daniel Peterson »

Gadianton wrote:when is the last time the Review has solicited material from him?

Can't remember. We've had something like 200 different reviewers; I don't always get back to all of them.
_ludwigm
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _ludwigm »

Enuma Elish wrote:...
in my opinion, the FARMS Review is currently the best and most scholarly journal in all of Mormondom.
...

In this sentence we can find the hidden evaluation of all others.
- Whenever a poet or preacher, chief or wizard spouts gibberish, the human race spends centuries deciphering the message. - Umberto Eco
- To assert that the earth revolves around the sun is as erroneous as to claim that Jesus was not born of a virgin. - Cardinal Bellarmine at the trial of Galilei
_Jason Bourne
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Re: Mopologetics and the Need for "Token" Gentile Scholars

Post by _Jason Bourne »


Fascinating. I knew your scholarly acumen would come in handy here, Dr. Robbers. Can you recall whether or not Waltz was thrown under the bus for this behavior?


Watlz is a gentleman and is respected as one by LDS who know him. He also spent many years studying Mormonism and had thousands of books on Mormonism. I believe he was brought up a Jehovah's Witness in his early year. In his studies he came to a point where for him it was either Catholicism or Mormonism. I think his pick for Catholicisms was more based on his view that an apostasy was not able to be substantiated.

He defends Mormonism in a well thought out rational way. He is objective. He is often criticized by EV types for being a fake Catholic and too much of a Mormon sympathizer. He will defend Catholicism and no Mormon that interacts with him that I have seen ever throws him under the bus when his views diverge from Mormonism. The reason I have already noted. He is a gentleman. And unlike the phony characterization Scratch and Gad spin here most LDS apologists are gentlemen (and women) as well. They are quite fine with a person like David Waltz who may be friendly by certainly is not LDS.

You should study David's behavior, and emulate it.
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