Big Love Season 3 thread

[_silentkid]

The scene I feel like they fudged on purposefully in order to heighten drama and create sympathy for Barb is the excommunication scene. I've never been involved in one of those, but I do know the tone that those types of proceedings tend to have, and that's not it. Nor would it go down that way, as far as I know. I'm sure that there are people out there that can point to personal experiences in which there was some sensed and even expressed verbal hostility, but I think that those scenarios would have to been part of a very small minority. "DO YOU REPENT?!" Hardly credible. I mean, hey, it's TV. But if you're going to toot your own horn about authenticity, then you'd better deliver.

When I told my mom about the episode and the Court of Love scene, she said that when she went to my dad's, it was the worst experience of her life. In a negative way, not a positive way. She didn't want to talk about it any more than that. I don't know about how authentic the scene was having never been through one myself. I think the most embarrassing aspect of the Court of Love is that it exists at all. A bunch of solemn old dudes get together to discuss your personal life with you, pronounce judgement, and then kick you out of their church in the name of Jesus. Amen.

[_TAK]

I thought it was quite funny that Roman admitting to pulling a Hoffman on the Church with fake documents. Yet another twist of the knife ..

Other than that I liked the end with Nikki showing up with her daughter. That should prove interesting in the next season.

[_cinepro]

They also showed the Henrickson's having a private sacrament service (with Bill Paxton delivering the most sincere and heart-felt sacrament prayer I have ever heard).

So for those keeping track, they've shown a baptism, baptism for the dead (in a motel room spa), Temple prayer circle and endowment, and sacrament.

[_Jason Bourne]

I thought that this was the best episode of iBig Love that I've seen. Some louts would like to simply dismiss this program as a "soap opera," but I think that it is the best television drama that has ever been made about Mormonism. (Feel free to nominate counter-examples.) Some of us want Mormonism to be represented in the arts.

Are there any other television dramas about Mormonism out there?

Was the temple ceremony portrayed respectfully? Yes; I think it was. There was and admirably calm sense of serenity about all of it. Further, the men in the Celestial Room paced about as if they were Vulcans, which seems reasonably accurate, in my opinion. And then there was the (horribly?) TBM touch at the end: "Your fifteen minutes is up." Ouch.

How would you know? Have you been through the temple?

[_TAK]

TBM touch at the end: "Your fifteen minutes is up."

I don't recall this.. Is that something that happens at busy times?

[_Jason Bourne]

TBM touch at the end: "Your fifteen minutes is up."

I don't recall this.. Is that something that happens at busy times?

It never happens. This is another embellishment Scratch loves to perpetrate on the unsuspecting.

[_Rollo Tomasi]

It never happens. This is another embellishment Scratch loves to perpetrate on the unsuspecting.

Something similar used to happen in "the old days" when temples were scarce and much more busy than today. But usually you had to stay in the Celestial Room a long time in order to be 'encouraged' to leave before other full sessions were about to come in. I've never seen it done like it was portrayed in Big Love, but I do recall seeing folks encouraged to move on when the temple was especially busy (particularly where the Celestial Room was on the small side).

[_gramps]

It never happens. This is another embellishment Scratch loves to perpetrate on the unsuspecting.

Something similar used to happen in "the old days" when temples were scarce and much more busy than today. But usually you had to stay in the Celestial Room a long time in order to be 'encouraged' to leave before other full sessions were about to come in. I've never seen it done like it was portrayed in Big Love, but I do recall seeing folks encouraged to move on when the temple was especially busy (particularly where the Celestial Room was on the small side).

My friend asked if there was a time limit. I also don't remember one. I went to the Salt Lake Theat.....Temple most of the time. They did hurry you through and I was never encouraged to spend time in the celestial room.

But, no, no time limit.

[_floatingboy]

When I told my mom about the episode and the Court of Love scene, she said that when she went to my dad's, it was the worst experience of her life. In a negative way, not a positive way. She didn't want to talk about it any more than that. I don't know about how authentic the scene was having never been through one myself. I think the most embarrassing aspect of the Court of Love is that it exists at all. A bunch of solemn old dudes get together to discuss your personal life with you, pronounce judgement, and then kick you out of their church in the name of Jesus. Amen.

I guess mainly what I was thinking was that, regardless of how embarrassed and shocked a person might feel in the proceedings, there isn't the "witch hunt" aspect nor the derisive tone that seems to be going on in the Brian Laundrie scene. Even if the whole concept of a high council court is messed up, oddly enough, I believe that their hearts are in the right place. It's a weird balance of good intentions within a setting that was misguided from the outset. Always there are counterexamples, and undoubtedly people can site instances in which they are convinced that someone involved took personal pleasure in seeing them go down or be made to squirm. But that has to be the exception, in my opinion.

I've never been in a "court of love" (I honestly had never even heard that phrase!), but I have been disciplined by the bishopric. I honestly never felt like the process had any effect on me and that any progress I made was personal and had been made before I even talked to the bishop. But I can say that in my experience, the bishopric was very respectful and loving and didn't try to get really specific information out of me (although I know that happens).

Based on what I've read recently (inspired by this thread), I'm wondering, Silentkid, if the ugliness your mom alludes to is based largely on the fact that they undoubtedly made your dad give details about what happened. To a wife, such details have got to be heart wrenching. I understand that they're just trying to be informed so that they can make a proper decision, but it sounds like often they ask way too much. If it hasn't already, the church should really look into setting bounds on what can be asked and clarifying why questions are asked in the first place in order to make sure that the accused are afforded more dignity.

As for the "solemn old men" thing...I'm sure you meant it to be somewhat funny, but these are just average joes being put in a position that the vast majority of them would rather not be in, having to uphold church policy that they may not even fully understand themselves. My dad was a high councilor for years, and from the very little he talked about courts, I gathered that it was not even close to being his favorite part of the job.

[_silentkid]

I guess mainly what I was thinking was that, regardless of how embarrassed and shocked a person might feel in the proceedings, there isn't the "witch hunt" aspect nor the derisive tone that seems to be going on in the Brian Laundrie scene. Even if the whole concept of a high council court is messed up, oddly enough, I believe that their hearts are in the right place. It's a weird balance of good intentions within a setting that was misguided from the outset. Always there are counterexamples, and undoubtedly people can site instances in which they are convinced that someone involved took personal pleasure in seeing them go down or be made to squirm. But that has to be the exception, in my opinion.

I agree with you here. For the sake of drama, HBO portrayed the situation in a harsh fashion. I don't think most excommunication proceedings play out that way. But, there have been a few "witch hunts" against outspoken intellectuals (i.e. the September Six). Some have spoken of extremely negative experiences with the "court of love". Again, they are probably the exception, but the precedent exists.

I've never been in a "court of love" (I honestly had never even heard that phrase!), but I have been disciplined by the bishopric. I honestly never felt like the process had any effect on me and that any progress I made was personal and had been made before I even talked to the bishop. But I can say that in my experience, the bishopric was very respectful and loving and didn't try to get really specific information out of me (although I know that happens).

Me too, and I had a similar experience. I probably told him more than he wanted to hear. Woops.

Based on what I've read recently (inspired by this thread), I'm wondering, Silentkid, if the ugliness your mom alludes to is based largely on the fact that they undoubtedly made your dad give details about what happened. To a wife, such details have got to be heart wrenching. I understand that they're just trying to be informed so that they can make a proper decision, but it sounds like often they ask way too much. If it hasn't already, the church should really look into setting bounds on what can be asked and clarifying why questions are asked in the first place in order to make sure that the accused are afforded more dignity.

The Stake President and the Bishop already knew the details. They had been confessed. Why the need to go through all of that a second time with a bunch more people present? Why the need for the "court"? Can't the Bishop and the Stake President handle it? My whole issue with the excommunication proceeding is that I don't think it needs to occur at all. I haven't yet heard a good reason for it. Rather than set boundaries on questions, just do away with the process. Let the Stake President and Bishop handle it.

As for the "solemn old men" thing...I'm sure you meant it to be somewhat funny, but these are just average joes being put in a position that the vast majority of them would rather not be in, having to uphold church policy that they may not even fully understand themselves. My dad was a high councilor for years, and from the very little he talked about courts, I gathered that it was not even close to being his favorite part of the job.

It's "solemn old dudes" man. It was meant to be funny. My grandpa had to sit in on some as well. I understand the position they are put in. Let's get that changed. They don't need to be put in that uncomfortable position either. The "court of love" is a relic of the church's past that needs to be dropped, just like other out-dated practices (i.e. temple penalties, blood atonement, oath of vengeance, etc.). in my opinion.