Young Earth Frustration

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_stemelbow
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _stemelbow »

Hoops wrote:Sure there is. The text demands that history/time began on "the first day". Light requires time to "function".


I don't know what you're saying. Its clearly assumed that something was before verse 3--before light. If that is the case, then time did not begin upon the creation of light. even the earth and heaven were created before light. And it must be assumed that something was before earth and heaven, right?
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Stem


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_just me
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _just me »

stemelbow wrote:
Hoops wrote:Sure there is. The text demands that history/time began on "the first day". Light requires time to "function".


I don't know what you're saying. Its clearly assumed that something was before verse 3--before light. If that is the case, then time did not begin upon the creation of light. even the earth and heaven were created before light. And it must be assumed that something was before earth and heaven, right?


That doesn't mean that time existed. Time is a measurement that we use on Earth. Many believe that eternity, where God is, is outside of space and time.
~Those who benefit from the status quo always attribute inequities to the choices of the underdog.~Ann Crittenden
~The Goddess is not separate from the world-She is the world and all things in it.~
_Buffalo
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _Buffalo »

Hoops wrote:Sure there is. The text demands that history/time began on "the first day". Light requires time to "function".


You're giving the authors too much credit. They were obviously not deep thinkers.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_jon
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _jon »

just me wrote:He does not believe that radio carbon dating is reliable.


Why?

Does he believe the interpretation of translated words from people who wrote their interpretation of events that they'd heard about (scripture) is reliable?
'Church pictures are not always accurate' (The Nehor May 4th 2011)

Morality is doing what is right, regardless of what you are told.
Religion is doing what you are told, regardless of what is right.
_just me
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _just me »

jon wrote:
just me wrote:He does not believe that radio carbon dating is reliable.


Why?

Does he believe the interpretation of translated words from people who wrote their interpretation of events that they'd heard about (scripture) is reliable?


Basically, he said that there is no way to know for sure that carbon 14 has always degenerated (sorry, can't think of proper science term this early) at the same rate.

He believes that everything (just about) that the church teaches is reliable. Of course. He is now aware of some of the issues but has chosen to ignore them in favor of faith.

edit: lame grammar error
Last edited by Guest on Wed Jul 20, 2011 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
~Those who benefit from the status quo always attribute inequities to the choices of the underdog.~Ann Crittenden
~The Goddess is not separate from the world-She is the world and all things in it.~
_Buffalo
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _Buffalo »

just me wrote:Basically, he said that there is know way to know for sure that carbon 14 has always degenerated (sorry, can't think of proper science term this early) at the same rate.

He believes that everything (just about) that the church teaches is reliable. Of course. He is now aware of some of the issues but has chosen to ignore them in favor of faith.


There are many methods of dating a sample - and they all agree with each other.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.

B.R. McConkie, © Intellectual Reserve wrote:There are those who say that revealed religion and organic evolution can be harmonized. This is both false and devilish.
_Runtu
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _Runtu »

Hoops wrote:If you're referring to his C-14 article, I think his point is that c-14 dating ... uh.... techniques make assumptions that aren't warranted. I'm not sure why he would address other techniques in an article specific to c-14 dating.


What bothers me is that a lot of young-earth creationists I have read attack C-14 dating (vastly overstating the inaccuracy, as I said), as if C-14 is the only method of dating. It's not, and it really doesn't apply at all to old fossils (over about 50,000 years).

Dendochronology (tree rings) is a good example. It's remarkably simple: because tree rings correspond to weather and other patterns, you can match ring series on a younger tree with corresponding rings on an older tree (this is called anchoring). You can chain these samples back in time, until of course you run out of samples. Fully anchored samples can take us back about 11,000 years. So, even on its own, dendochronology shows an earth age almost twice the age that young-earth creationists insist upon.

One can combine other methods, such as sedimentary evidence and radiological dating, with dendochronology to go much farther back than that. For example, you might find a piece of petrified wood in a layer of sediment that you know dates to a certain approximate date, cross-check that approximate date with overlapping radiological dating, and then use the rings in the petrified wood to go back from there. Yes, it's approximate, but given three different methods, it's a fairly safe bet that the approximate date is correct.

So, to maintain a young earth age, one must deny the validity not only of C-14 dating, but of all radiological dating, tree rings, glacial ice cores, starlight distances, and sedimentary layers of rock. All this just because one insists on a literal reading of a text.

I don't understand it.
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If you just talk, I find that your mouth comes out with stuff. -- Karl Pilkington
_Molok
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _Molok »

http://www.creationworldview.org/articl ... .asp?id=50

This has to be my favorite article by far. Most people would think proving a young earth is a hard enough task. This guy isn't content to rest on his laurels though, he has to prove that dragons existed too!
_Molok
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _Molok »

Slightly off topic but the writing style for these articles reminds me of Darrick.
_Runtu
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Re: Young Earth Frustration

Post by _Runtu »

Molok wrote:http://www.creationworldview.org/articles_view.asp?id=50

This has to be my favorite article by far. Most people would think proving a young earth is a hard enough task. This guy isn't content to rest on his laurels though, he has to prove that dragons existed too!


Oh, dear. This is what I mean by hyperliteral. Apparently, some people do not understand metaphor.
Runtu's Rincón

If you just talk, I find that your mouth comes out with stuff. -- Karl Pilkington
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