The Infinite atonement--no not the book

[_stemelbow]

Choosing the religious life might be the better option if you don't want to take any risks at all. Say there is a Mormon god then all the exmormons on here might be a little screwed. They probably won't make it to the CK. However; I am 99.99999% sure there isn't a Mormon god or a god for that matter. I am willing to take those odds and live my life how I want.

Is there no risk in faith? It seems you don't think so. If there is a God and He's more of the conservative protestant stripe then the risk for Mormons is pretty big. Whatever the case your confidence in your position shows you really aren't taking any risks in your mind anywho. The problem of course is you don't get to have hope like me wherein I can look forward to a day when mankind and womankind will have such unity and love for each other, we'd never want to kill, maim, or even belittle each other. You'll always be left with the option that humanity will always be full of murder, maimin' and mocking each other. Disunity will alwasy be your reality. That seems sad to me, well unless you just live for yourself of course.

So if the atheist is right he/she gets to live the life they want and the religious person follows some sort of belief system with a bunch of rules. They both die and neither live again.

But it makes it appear at the expense of others. Living the life you want can't cure the hate, the disunity, the murder and wars. Alls it can do it is cause you to turn a blind eye to the evil while focusing on yourself. I might be overstating that, but I might not.

If the religious person is right then the atheist person is a little screwed and so is all the other religions.

But if I'm right as a Mormon, even you atheists will suck it up, accept truth, and enjoy a united peaceful eternity.

[_Neginoth]

Given these odds, I choose the inexplicable search for God. To find a way to exceed the sum of human experience. Fantasy? Perhaps. Death will decide that. But in the mean, I will strive for access to that Absolute Truth, as problematic as it may now seem to me.

N

Choosing the religious life might be the better option if you don't want to take any risks at all. Say there is a Mormon god then all the exmormons on here might be a little screwed. They probably won't make it to the CK. However; I am 99.99999% sure there isn't a Mormon god or a god for that matter. I am willing to take those odds and live my life how I want.

So if the atheist is right he/she gets to live the life they want and the religious person follows some sort of belief system with a bunch of rules. They both die and neither live again.

If the religious person is right then the atheist person is a little screwed and so is all the other religions.

Ahh, but there are always risks, are there not? Choosing Atheism or Theism is a risk. Once your choice is made you risk staying true to your principles. Every choice has its risks, till the end of your days, without discrimination.

And there are rules to every game. Atheists have rules. Rules in society, rules in relationships, rules of the physical universe and so on. It is likewise true for Theists. Either way, each person is living the life they want to live.


But there is still some doubt in you, albeit 1/100,000th?


Thus, the rub. And here I want to emphasize again the risks you claim that a theist doesn't take. Which god? Which faith?

[_Rambo]

Thus, the rub. And here I want to emphasize again the risks you claim that a theist doesn't take. Which god? Which faith?

Well yeah that's right. Which god and faith are you to follow? Might as well be atheist.

The thing is theist seems to have way more rules to live by. An atheist just has the laws of society and then they can go do whatever the hell they want.

I feel way less restricted compared to when I was a Mormon.

[_Neginoth]

Rambo,

Sure. If that gives you confidence.

But does that satisfy you? Submitting yourself to instinct?

Why not throw in all your chips and risk gaining apotheosis?

[_Rambo]

Rambo,

Sure. If that gives you confidence.

But does that satisfy you? Submitting yourself to instinct?

Why not throw in all your chips and risk gaining apotheosis?

I guess there would be that tiny bit of chance that I could be an exalted god. I'm not much of a gambler though and I don't like my odds.

Doing whatever I want (law biding) sure beats the hell out of someone telling me what to do.

So in my eyes I only live once so it better be a fun fullfilling life then. Not a life where I am stuck in boring meetings all the time...

[_Mad Viking]

Fine. You have a different view of the LDS religion than I do. But I'm here to discuss it. What does atheism offer in terms of something good? As I see it Mormonism at least offers the opportunity to have lasting love and unity among humanity at some point. Atheism doesn't offer much if anything on that front.

For some reason I'm willing to concede that for the human race in it's current state, religion (even the LDS form of it) offers more utility than atheism. Are we discussing utility or truth?

You see Buffalo and Rambo tried to say Atheism is better because it makes them more happy than when they were Mormons.

I don't know about that. But I am certainly happier being an atheist than I was as a believing Mormon. I whole heartedly recognize that that will not be the case for many Mormons. They will be much happier as Mormons than they would as atheist. It offers a lot of utility to them.

[_stemelbow]

For some reason I'm willing to concede that for the human race in it's current state, religion (even the LDS form of it) offers more utility than atheism. Are we discussing utility or truth?

I have many reasons why I accept that the LDS religion holds more truth than any other mode of living and thinking I've seen. But my point here is to discuss how its useful to believe. The good in belief ont his is atonement. Without it love and unity will never reach the possible lengths it is to reach in eternity if the LDS religion is true.

So, seeing as there is no hopeful unity and love-filled end in atheism, it makes it all seem very dreadful to me. How can it be viewed otherwise?

I don't know about that. But I am certainly happier being an atheist than I was as a believing Mormon. I whole heartedly recognize that that will not be the case for many Mormons. They will be much happier as Mormons than they would as atheist. It offers a lot of utility to them.

I think we can agree on this point, then.

[_Buffalo]

Fine. You have a different view of the LDS religion than I do. But I'm here to discuss it. What does atheism offer in terms of something good? As I see it Mormonism at least offers the opportunity to have lasting love and unity among humanity at some point. Atheism doesn't offer much if anything on that front. You see Buffalo and Rambo tried to say Atheism is better because it makes them more happy than when they were Mormons. But that doesn't help particularly since there are LDS who would say the exact opposite. Perhaps convictions religious or anti-religious aren't the factor that brings them happiness at all.

That's not much of a promise of something good. I mean, believers have been awaiting the imminent return of Jesus since Paul the apostle. It's obvious he's not coming.

Stem, from a practical standpoint, what does the LDS faith offer people that atheism doesn't. I mean, ignore the somedays and the wishes. What does it offer right now?

The only thing I can think of is a sense of community. A double edged sword.

And regarding happiness, most Mormons have always been believers of some stripe or another - and most are lifelong Mormons. They really wouldn't know.

[_Buffalo]

I have many reasons why I accept that the LDS religion holds more truth than any other mode of living and thinking I've seen. But my point here is to discuss how its useful to believe. The good in belief ont his is atonement. Without it love and unity will never reach the possible lengths it is to reach in eternity if the LDS religion is true.

So, seeing as there is no hopeful unity and love-filled end in atheism, it makes it all seem very dreadful to me. How can it be viewed otherwise?

.

What sort of unity has the LDS faith contributed to the world so far, Stem?

[_Mad Viking]

I have many reasons why I accept that the LDS religion holds more truth than any other mode of living and thinking I've seen.

Such as?

But my point here is to discuss how its useful to believe.

Useful for everyone?

The good in belief ont his is atonement. Without it love and unity will never reach the possible lengths it is to reach in eternity if the LDS religion is true.

The atonement is necessary if the LDS religion is true? Uh... yeah... IF...

So, seeing as there is no hopeful unity and love-filled end in atheism, it makes it all seem very dreadful to me. How can it be viewed otherwise?

I wasn't filled with dread before I existed. I won't be filled with dread when I don't.