DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

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_Maxrep
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Maxrep »

Kishkumen wrote: But in a history of exchanges between two people there is a certain give and take that exists to allow room for comment. I am not calling Daniel a bigot. I am saying that he is stingy in that give and take. A cool guy will say, "you know, I may have been wrong about that," and then others around him say, "no problem, you're just human like the rest of us."

Ray, and others, have made a point to illustrate the friendly and genuine encounters that they have had with Dan. I completely believe these accounts. I don't know this DCP though.

The person who I am familiar with is simply message board Dan. For many others, this may be the only Dan they know as well. He is witty and intelligent. As Kishkumen pointed out, he is also stingy in conceding points that should be conceded. I further feel that his work environment, and his church/social community(many times the same group) place him in a position where he feels inclined to resort to dialogue online that is intellectually dishonest. Maybe this is a combination of personal pride as well as a desire to protect the community with which he is a part of. Who knows. It is rather odd though, that when an individual sets out to defend their version of the Christ narative, they quickly abandon all charateristics of Christ as the discussion progresses.

Being honest and fair while defending the church online, is more than difficult. Most members who may try are aware of this. I don't think Dan, and most other members for that matter, really have the temperment or training in public defense of the church. I'll bet Dan would like to have a "do over" with regards to internet forums for the past ten years. I'll bet he would choose to leave it all alone.

If DCP was consistantly a courteous and honest representative of his religion online, he would have my respect. Again, I only know forum DCP, and forum DCP has not been consistantly courteous and honest in my experience.
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_Doctor Scratch
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Doctor Scratch »

RayAgostini wrote:
I guess this reaffirms to me that message boards aren't a very good medium for "assessing people". I've been "sucked" into them as much as you have, and have posted some ridiculous things here, which I now regret. I saw DCP's human side when he paid a visit to me, in 2006, in my humble abode in an obscure suburb south of Sydney. I'm not suggesting he did this purely out of "guileless charity". Obviously, he was motivated by his Mormon beliefs, and apparently a belief that I could be "reclaimed", which he sincerely believed was the best thing on earth he could do for me, being a 100-percenter true-blue believing Mormon. He acted on motives which were sacred and important to him, which he felt would also be to my benefit. I've often mused on the thought that while my local ward went about their activities and worship, I had entertained in my cheap bach-flat, unknown to them, perhaps the most famous (some would say, "infamous") and influential "Mormon apologist" alive today. I still don't understand this, and why DCP felt that I was even worth a visit,


It's not that hard to figure out. Around that time, you would have still seemed "in flux." On ZLMB you had developed a reputation as somehow with a few screws loose (and have you forgotten how you were needled by DCP back then?), and as someone who "flip flops." Someone, in other words, who could potentially be lured back into the Church and held up as a shining example of reconversion. And if Dan could take credit for it, it would boost his reputation as the top Mopologist. Think about it: Do you remember the reaction from the MDD crowd when Don Bradley got rebaptized? It was like he could walk on water. I'm sure the only drawback for the apologists is the fact that none of them could really take credit for it. Now, if DCP had managed to reconvert *you*.... What an accomplishment that would have been! Part of Dan's persona is reliant upon him coming across to the TBMs as someone who can "save" the wayward souls--someone whose arguments and rhetorical gifts are so great that he can actually fend off the incoming tidal waves of doubt and apostasy. Of course, the reality is that he's probably drummed as many people out of the Church than he has "saved." But this is all just part of the larger game-playing that he and the other Mopologists live for.

Ask yourself this: Did he communicate with you "just because", or say "hello" out of the blue? Or were the PMs, emails, etc. done in such a way so as to persuade you of something?

Because I know the "real DCP", and he's very much as you'll see in his Mormon Stories interview with Dan Wotherspoon. Why was he willing to answer so many personal questions posed to him by Dan W.? Because he wasn't in "enemy territory" with Dan W. Though I have a great admiration for John Dehlin, I don't believe he could have handled this interview as well as Dan W. did.


Dan W. was pitching softballs and cream puffs.
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
_Kishkumen
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Kishkumen »

Maxrep wrote:If DCP was consistantly a courteous and honest representative of his religion online, he would have my respect. Again, I only know forum DCP, and forum DCP has not been consistantly courteous and honest in my experience.


It is true, however, that he is held up to a higher standard because of his close relationship with the Church as one of its employees. I can be a real jackass, but fewer people will be concerned because I only represent myself, and to a certain (lesser?) extent the community here on this board.
"Petition wasn’t meant to start a witch hunt as I’ve said 6000 times." ~ Hanna Seariac, LDS apologist
_harmony
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _harmony »

RayAgostini wrote:
Drifting wrote:LOL! Posting at gunpoint, brilliant.

I'm saying he was bad mannered, ill tempered, overly dramatic, enjoyed playing the victim, deliberately made inflammatory comments...


We talking about DCP, or Steve Benson?


Steve Benson has 10,000 posts here?

Drifting wrote:When faced with genuine questions and substantive challenges he avoided answering. In favour of spending an inordinate amount of time joining in the board 'banter' whilst claiming lack of time to respond to the points of substance.


What "banter" should he have joined? The ones about "garmies", or "Holy Joe" threads? Which planet are you on, Drift? A Mormon-free one?


He avoided those. Just like he avoided the ones where Will was slinging his bitch comments.

At least he had the gumption to even post here. How many posters here can tolerate 6,000-plus posts on MDDB, without going insane? You don't give the man the credit he deserves. Most here can't even bear to read MDDB, much less do 6,000+posts there.


Most here are blocked from reading there, and banned from posting. Which part of blocked and banned is not understandable?

Dan was a vibrant poster here, one who dared to mingle with "apostates", which most of his Mormon peers wouldn't even think of. He's sort of like Jesus, you know, unable to resist going by the tavern without going in and talking to "apostates", thus becoming a "friend of publicans and sinners", when most of his peers on MDDB thought he was NUTS for even posting here.


You know, that just made me laugh and cry at the same time. Not to mention that it's ludicrous.

The truth is that Dan has a deep spirituality, a solid conviction, and he doesn't believe that anyone is "beyond redemption".


The truth is, Dan has an inate inability to realize that he's often wrong, that he is often a poor representative of the gospel of Jesus Christ, and that he's no different from anyone else. He's smart, and a smart aleck, and he has a witty delivery that is killer funny... but at the end of the day, it's entirely possible he's wrong, and his inability to see that is his single most evident weakness. Spirituality, conviction, and belief does not bestow truth on anyone or anything. And that's the truth.

If he did, he wouldn't have wasted his time here.


He didn't waste his time here. If he thinks he did, then he, again, is wrong.

Sadly, you all drove him away, and his voice here is no more.


All? Gag me with a spoon. What drivel. Many of us have often defended him, and tried to befriend him. He would have none of it. I'm not "real"; we're not "real". He gave no support when Will was attacking me and the rest of the women here. He is only interested in conversation if he feels can "win"... whether by changing the other person's mind about the church, or driving them down into the dust so he can dust off his feet. There's no "equal" in Dan's mind about the people here; we are his inferiors, period.

It's now just an echo-chamber. He didn't "run away" from questions, Drift, he ran away from a mob intent on silencing him, and all of their "questions" were designed traps very similar to those used against Jesus. No matter how he answered, he'd still get crucified.


Balderdash. He didn't run away at all.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
_Hasa Diga Eebowai
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Hasa Diga Eebowai »

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_Yoda

Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Yoda »

Harmony wrote:Balderdash. He didn't run away at all.


Agreed. He didn't run. He voluntarily walked.
_Chap
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Chap »

liz3564 wrote:
Harmony wrote:Balderdash. He didn't run away at all.


Agreed. He didn't run. He voluntarily walked.


Yup. He walked ....

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Zadok:
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_Doctor Scratch
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Doctor Scratch »

zeezrom wrote:Well would you look at this. Dr. Scratch gave DCP a gold star!

Now, time to wait and see DCP give one back.


Indeed. I deserve a star for all the lessons I've given on the need to be kind to others, to not condescend or mock, and to not engage in smear campaigns.
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
_moksha
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _moksha »

RayAgostini wrote:Their "addiction" is to hate Dan Peterson, and they can't let go of it. Like schools of piranha, they wait to devour the prey without mercy.


Perhaps these piranha would be less likely to school around waiting to devour Dr. Peterson if they realized, in all likelihood, that he only tastes like chicken.

I wish Dr. Peterson would return and I know that I am not the only one who wishes that on this board.
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_Buffalo
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Re: DCP Launches an Attack on Kishkumen

Post by _Buffalo »

harmony wrote:Balderdash. He didn't run away at all.


Dude, he totally ran away.
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