Blixa wrote: You know why me, you keep throwing around references to Don Bradley's essay in The Persistence of Polygamy, but clearly you haven't read it or you wouldn't be asking incredibly banal questions like these...
I don't care what you believe, what experiences you had in the 70's in NYC, nor the thread count you prefer in your cotton. But I wish you would be a little bit more honest about things you claim to have read.
And your comments have been proof that you read have it? This is an internet board that is hostile toward Mormonism not an academic forum where academic literature can be dissected and discussed. The tone does not support such discussion on this board.
Here is what I know: the case against joseph and fanny is not so damning. And like I said, the parents had no problem with it nor did her brother who all remained faithful to the church.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
Blixa wrote: You know why me, you keep throwing around references to Don Bradley's essay in The Persistence of Polygamy, but clearly you haven't read it or you wouldn't be asking incredibly banal questions like these...
I don't care what you believe, what experiences you had in the 70's in NYC, nor the thread count you prefer in your cotton. But I wish you would be a little bit more honest about things you claim to have read.
As I stated, it is not so damning and that was my point with Don's piece.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
why me wrote:And it does seem that fanny and joseph were sealed and fanny's parents were perfectly okay with it.
Which makes it hard to explain why Fanny Alger isn't listed on Family Search as a spouse of Joseph Smith...
Why Me, consider this a nudge type contact in your direction...
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Nightlion wrote:The greatest reassurance of Joseph being a righteous man is his own words as he faced certain death. . . He could have saved his own skin if he had denied all.
I'm afraid I must disagree with you. I have never come across any source that claims the Carthage Greys stopped and gave Joseph a fair chance to deny everything just before they started shooting at him.
why me wrote:Did oliver catch Joseph Smith and fanny in the barn or was it heresay?
Neither. Emma was the one who caught Joseph in the barn with Fanny, not Oliver.
"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"
Nightlion wrote:The greatest reassurance of Joseph being a righteous man is his own words as he faced certain death. . . He could have saved his own skin if he had denied all.
I'm afraid I must disagree with you. I have never come across any source that claims the Carthage Greys stopped and gave Joseph a fair chance to deny everything just before they started shooting at him.
I thought they started shooting shortly after Joseph cracked the door open and emptied his gun down the stairwell at them...
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Mary wrote:Can anyone point me to the best arguments/evidence that suggest that Joseph Smith never committed adultery and never had sexual relationships with any of his plural or polyandrous wives.
Thanks.
To believe that Joseph Smith married thirty something women in two years only to not have sex with them is a stretch to be sure. And to think that he didn't have an active sex life for two years with over thirty something women is also a stretch.
FIFY
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.
zeezrom wrote:If active LDS members could change one historical fact, it would be Joseph's sexual relationships.
Ever wonder why LDS members are just fine with Brigham Young (and others) having sex with all his polygamous wives but will not accept that Joseph Smith had sex with his wives?
Why the double standard?
I think part of it is that Joseph had so many polyandrous wives. BY had at least one, I think, but not as many as Joseph.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.
I think part of it is that Joseph had so many polyandrous wives. BY had at least one, I think, but not as many as Joseph.
That could be it. They can accept the men having multiple sex partners, but the idea of a woman being married and having sex with multiple men is going too far.
"We have taken up arms in defense of our liberty, our property, our wives, and our children; we are determined to preserve them, or die." - Captain Moroni - 'Address to the Inhabitants of Canada' 1775
DarkHelmet wrote: That could be it. They can accept the men having multiple sex partners, but the idea of a woman being married and having sex with multiple men is going too far.
Trut. Also, it just sounds like a big orgy.
Parley P. Pratt wrote:We must lie to support brother Joseph, it is our duty to do so.