No gay scout leaders but lots of molested boys

[_LittleNipper]

Christ choose to suffer. Christ choose to be humiliated. Christ choose to become sin. That is a lot for a perfect being. He could have just destroyed everything and start over. But He showed that He also loved the world and wanted what was best and perfect for it.

No he didn't.
He was arrested after being grassed up by one of his merry men.
And if He was a perfect being why did the Church He set up fail miserably? Thrice - oncinsight Adam, once in the Middle East and once in the America's. He's 3 - 0 down and His fourth attempt ain't going so well...

And couldn't destroy the world and start over. His Dad had previously told Noah He wouldn't let that happen again.

Christ, The Father, and The Holy Spirit are ONE GOD. The Church is not perfect but it exists as God wishes it to. I am not a Mormon --- I do not hold to their doctrines.True Christians are one in the body and spirit which is the Church. The Church is non-denominational.

[_DarkHelmet]

The State has never defind marriage. God guiding religious people did.

According to the Bible, a marriage is only valid if the wife is a virgin. If she is not a virgin, she must be stoned to death. Is it wrong that the secular law in the U.S. does not follow this Biblical marriage rule?

[_Elphaba]

Christ choose to suffer. Christ choose to be humiliated. Christ choose to become sin. That is a lot for a perfect being. He could have just destroyed everything and start over. But He showed that He also loved the world and wanted what was best and perfect for it.

You said Jesus "gave up" his life for us. I demonstrated you were wrong, and that he did not, in fact, give up anything.

Additionally, why is it a lot for a "perfect being" to suffer the things you list? In fact, the suffering would be much less than for a non-perfect being going through the same, given the perfect being knew it would all be over with within a few hours, and that he would come back to life better than ever. Millions of non-perfect beings, throughout the history of mankind, have suffered just as much as this "perfect being" did, and additional millions have suffered far worse. While I abhor the thought of anyone suffering what Christ supposedly suffered (if he is a historical person), his suffering is of no more consequence than these millions of others'.

[_just me]

The State has never defind marriage. God guiding religious people did.

According to the Bible, a marriage is only valid if the wife is a virgin. If she is not a virgin, she must be stoned to death. Is it wrong that the secular law in the U.S. does not follow this Biblical marriage rule?

It also says that divorced people can't marry again without committing adultery.

[_Yoda]

Christ choose to suffer. Christ choose to be humiliated. Christ choose to become sin. That is a lot for a perfect being. He could have just destroyed everything and start over. But He showed that He also loved the world and wanted what was best and perfect for it.

You said Jesus "gave up" his life for us. I demonstrated you were wrong, and that he did not, in fact, give up anything.

Additionally, why is it a lot for a "perfect being" to suffer the things you list? In fact, the suffering would be much less than for a non-perfect being going through the same, given the perfect being knew it would all be over with within a few hours, and that he would come back to life better than ever. Millions of non-perfect beings, throughout the history of mankind, have suffered just as much as this "perfect being" did, and additional millions have suffered far worse. While I abhor the thought of anyone suffering what Christ supposedly suffered (if he is a historical person), his suffering is of no more consequence than these millions of others'.

According to Mormon doctrine, Christ's suffering was far worse than anything anyone else suffered. His true suffering, according to doctrine, came in the Garden of Gethsemane when he prayed, and the father withdrew his presence. The father withdrew his presence AGAIN while he was on the cross, and he suffered the sins of the world AGAIN. First in the garden, then on the cross.

[_Elphaba]

According to Mormon doctrine, Christ's suffering was far worse than anything anyone else suffered. His true suffering, according to doctrine, came in the Garden of Gethsemane when he prayed, and the father withdrew his presence. The father withdrew his presence AGAIN while he was on the cross, and he suffered the sins of the world AGAIN. First in the garden, then on the cross.

I was raised LDS, though I am no longer a believer, so I know the Church's version of Christ's suffering. It's my impression that Little Nipper is not LDS, and because he had not referred to the Garden of Gethsemane specifically, I did not address it.

Regardless, even with the LDS version of Christ at Gethsemane, a few days of excruciating suffering, including a few hours of the withdrawal of his father's presence which Christ knew would be returned, does not compare whatsoever to the suffering of millions throughout time who have been tortured, starved, abandoned, emotionally abused, etc. for years, and possibly for their entire lives. This includes children, as opposed to Christ, who could not possibly understand why they had to endure such unbearable pain.

My main point, however, addressed LN's claim that Christ sacrificed, or "gave up" his life. There was no sacrifice, not on Christ's part, nor on Heavenly Father's part. They both knew Christ would only be dead a few days, and that when he returned his being would be perfect for eternity. That is not a sacrifice.

[_LittleNipper]

According to Mormon doctrine, Christ's suffering was far worse than anything anyone else suffered. His true suffering, according to doctrine, came in the Garden of Gethsemane when he prayed, and the father withdrew his presence. The father withdrew his presence AGAIN while he was on the cross, and he suffered the sins of the world AGAIN. First in the garden, then on the cross.

I was raised LDS, though I am no longer a believer, so I know the Church's version of Christ's suffering. It's my impression that Little Nipper is not LDS, and because he had not referred to the Garden of Gethsemane specifically, I did not address it.

Regardless, even with the LDS version of Christ at Gethsemane, a few days of excruciating suffering, including a few hours of the withdrawal of his father's presence which Christ knew would be returned, does not compare whatsoever to the suffering of millions throughout time who have been tortured, starved, abandoned, emotionally abused, etc. for years, and possibly for their entire lives. This includes children, as opposed to Christ, who could not possibly understand why they had to endure such unbearable pain.

My main point, however, addressed LN's claim that Christ sacrificed, or "gave up" his life. There was no sacrifice, not on Christ's part, nor on Heavenly Father's part. They both knew Christ would only be dead a few days, and that when he returned his being would be perfect for eternity. That is not a sacrifice.

Christ became sin for us. The Father could not even look on Him. Man will die. Death of the body, now comes to everyone--- and after that judgment. Being evil and filthy in thought, word, and deed --- we have nothing to guage what Christ did to save those who will believe on His name.

[_Shulem]

Christ became sin for us. The Father could not even look on Him. Man will die. Death of the body, now comes to everyone--- and after that judgment. Being evil and filthy in thought, word, and deed --- we have nothing to guage what Christ did to save those who will believe on His name.

Men who molest little boys are saints compared to the Monster God of the Bible!

Your doctrine is horrific and evil. The Heavenly Father is a murderer that drinks blood to satisfy his anger and calm himself down. He is truly an angry being that wants to control everything or else suffer.

Murdering Isaac on the altar to the glory of Jehovah is a perfect example to just how sick the holy Bible is. Commit murder in the name of JEHOVAH! Sharpen your knives ye saints and bleed the sacrifices. God drinks animal blood and wants you to drink the blood of his kid.

It really doesn't surprise me at all that Jesus died and was crucified. He was a goddamn crazy nut and the Romans needed to put him down. The god of the Bible is an evil monster and I'd wrap my hands around his neck and kill him myself if I could. But he isn't real. He is pure imagination -- the spook in the closet and that which creeps under the bed at night.

JEHOVAH THE DEMON GOD, SAYS, "GIVE ME BLOOD"



Paul O

[_LittleNipper]

Galatians 5:19-21
New International Version (NIV)

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Cross references:Galatians 5:19 : S 1Co 6:18Galatians 5:21 : Mt 15:19; Ro 13:13Galatians 5:21 : S Mt 25:34

[_Shulem]

that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

I wouldn't spend 2 seconds in the same room with the god of the Bible. He's a bloody bastard -- a cold blooded killer! He's an evil demon created by crazy prophets who lived in the Dark Ages.

I AM JEHOVAH I AM -- MAKE ME SWEET SACRIFICES OF BLOOD AND FLESH ON YOUR ALTARS -- KILL YOUR SON ISAAC AND OFFER HIM BEFORE ME -- MY NOSE DELIGHTS IN THE ODORS OF BURNT FLESH -- OBEY ME OR DIE!



Paul O