Pahoran wrote:Yes, that's why I generally stay away from this pit. I can't compete with talent like yours.
Aw shucks, the legendary king of zing has condescended to speak to us fine denizens of the cosmic sewer. I will candidly admit that folks like you and Hamblin have always brought out the worst in me.
And yet you managed to display your gratuitous spite before I was anywhere near this thread.
Isn't it about time you started taking responsibility for your own choices? Your "the Mormon made me do it" excuse is wearing rather thin.
And maybe Why Me is a bigger jerk than you thought; he's not a bigger jerk than you, though.
Cicero wrote:Kamenraider above identified the JOD quote that is most similar (but which is subject to many different interpretations):
Journal of Discourses Vol. 6, pg. 256:
"You are sent out as shepherds to gather the sheep together; and remember that they are not your sheep: they belong to Him that sends you. Then do not make a choice of any of those sheep; do not make selections before they are brought home and put into the fold. You understand that."
No; a quote very much like that is in the JoD. I've chased it down. I just can't find it today.
I haven't found one any day. I think you are mistaken.
Frankly, I think the bogus quote Maxrep loves so much, if it's not an outright fabrication (which were not unheard of in Eastern newspapers in the mid to late 19th) is probably a creative "what he really meant" paraphrase of the authentic quote Kamenraider provided.
Incidentally, here is the passage that immediately follows the quoted portion:
The principle of plurality of wives never will be done away. Some sisters have had revelations that when this time passes away and they go through the veil every woman will have a husband to herself. I wish more of our young men would take to themselves wives of the daughters of Zion and not wait for us old men to take them all; go-ahead upon the right principle young gentlemen and God bless you forever and ever and make you fruitful, that we may fill the mountains and then the earth with righteous inhabitants.
So the real Heber C. Kimball contradicts the bogus Heber C. Kimball.
You have eluded a key point of the thread. How is it your post #10 appeared on a thread that had been locked for almost an entire day? Did you use a little known back door tool only afforded to members who have managed to accumulate 2000 posts or better?
Have you been contacted by any apologists at MAD who have frowned on your abuse of that tool?
Try and offer a reply that is not dismissive non response
I don't expect to see same-sex marriage in Utah within my lifetime. - Scott Lloyd, Oct 23 2013
You have eluded a key point of the thread. How is it your post #10 appeared on a thread that had been locked for almost an entire day? Did you use a little known back door tool only afforded to members who have managed to accumulate 2000 posts or better?
Have you been contacted by any apologists at MAD who have frowned on your abuse of that tool?
Try and offer a reply that is not dismissive non response
There's no "little known back door." Contributors on MDDB have limited moderator privileges in threads they start. That has been the case for some time.
I didn't "abuse" anything. I made a substantive response to a substantive question, namely the provenance of the Kimball misquote you love so much. I made no comments about you. And while no "apologists" have contacted me, I have received 5 rep points for that post.
Stormy Waters wrote:Hey Pahoran since you wanted to talk about not feeling the honesty how about we talk about Joseh Smith lying to his wife and the general membership about polygamy and why we should trust such a person.
Oh and by the way keep in mind that threads don't just get shut down when they don't go your way. You won't be coddled here.
Can you clarify Pahoran, do you care about honesty or not?
If that quote is indeed a fabrication. . . with apologies to YahooBot. . . then clearly it would behoove us all to lay it to rest once and for all.
Can you tell us more about the New York Times story/article in which it first appeared? Is there a scan online somewhere? How about the author; what was his or her name, and what was his or her experience with Mormons that qualified him or her to write the piece?
Thanks, Shades
"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"
Stormy Waters wrote:Hey Pahoran since you wanted to talk about not feeling the honesty how about we talk about Joseh Smith lying to his wife and the general membership about polygamy and why we should trust such a person.
Oh and by the way keep in mind that threads don't just get shut down when they don't go your way. You won't be coddled here.
Can you clarify Pahoran, do you care about honesty or not?
Yes. But I won't be chasing every rabbit down every hole.
As you know, "brief accusations that require long explanations" are a popular polemical tool. Honest people don't rely upon them.
And the notion that the MDDB thread was locked because it wasn't going my way may be a comforting delusion, but it has little connection to reality. Not only did all of the substantive contributions to that thread support my point (which is hardly surprising, since I made them) you may notice that maxrep hasn't even tried to address any of them here.
If that quote is indeed a fabrication. . . with apologies to YahooBot. . . then clearly it would behoove us all to lay it to rest once and for all.
Can you tell us more about the New York Times story/article in which it first appeared? Is there a scan online somewhere? How about the author; what was his or her name, and what was his or her experience with Mormons that qualified him or her to write the piece?
Thanks, Shades
The article was written with the byline "From our correspondents," who were not named. Kimball was alleged to have uttered the bogus quote "some time ago." I don't know if the article is viewable in full anywhere, but it is discussed here.
Pahoran wrote:As you know, "brief accusations that require long explanations" are a popular polemical tool. Honest people don't rely upon them.
Coincidentally the reasons I married several other women without my wife's knowledge/consent also require a long explanation. But my wife just doesn't get it. I prepared a 56 page explanation but nothing is good enough for her! I'll try mentioning to her that her brief accusations that require long explanations are a popular polemical tool and see what effect that has. Thanks for the tip!
why me wrote: He battled the critics and usually won. So, I can understand why you guys may not like him.
In the war to win members for the Church, the prowess of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse may be quite counterproductive. Those attacking the village may be strewn across the field, but the villagers have abandoned the village in terror and remorse.