Exploring the Secret History of the Church

[_Franktalk]

Albion,

I quite agree the following is perfectly readable.

Oure fadir þat art in heuenes halwid be þi name;
Þi reume or kyngdom come to be.
Be þi wille don in herþe as it is doun in heuene.
yeue to us today oure eche dayes bred.
And foryeue to us oure dettis þat is oure synnys as we foryeuen to oure dettouris þat is to men þat han synned in us.
And lede us not into temptacion but delyuere us from euyl.

In fact it is almost identical to:

Our father which art in heauen,
hallowed be thy name.
Thy kingdom come.
Thy will be done in earth as it is in heauen.
Giue us this day our daily bread.
And forgiue us our debts as we forgiue our debters.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliuer us from euill.
Amen.

http://cunnan.sca.org.au/wiki/Old_English

Of course the rest of your post is just as valid as the first part.

[_Albion]

The evolution of the English language is not to me a question of "drift". English is an evolved language derived from influences as diverse as the ancient Britons, latin, European languages such as that spoken by Jutes and Saxons, and heavily influenced by early French as spoken by the Normans, the last great invaders. It wasn't until long after the advent of the KJ Bible that English developed grammatical form and uniform spelling. The first real dictionary of the language (the Oxford) didn't come until the latter half of the 19th century. But just because we can understand it better doesn't make the language of the KJ any more modern than the earlier language you quoted. Both are antiquated in comparison with the language today.

I'm sorry that you don't see validity in God's word...it is puzzling to me that a claimed believer can have such an attitude to Holy writ.

[_Franktalk]

I'm sorry that you don't see validity in God's word...it is puzzling to me that a claimed believer can have such an attitude to Holy writ.

Just as you misread scripture you misread my words as well.

[_Tobin]

I'm sorry that you don't see validity in God's word...it is puzzling to me that a claimed believer can have such an attitude to Holy writ.

Just as you misread scripture you misread my words as well.

Yep, that's a common failing of Albion. He holds up HIS understanding and distortion of God's words as his measure of what he'll believe or won't believe. Instead, he should seek the Lord and get the truth from him. Ah well, we have gone over this ground too many times already.

[_Bazooka]

He holds up HIS understanding and distortion of God's words as his measure of what he'll believe or won't believe. Instead, he should seek the Lord and get the truth from him. Ah well, we have gone over this ground too many times already.

How are you NOT holding up your understanding and (potential) distortion of Gods words as a measure of what you will or won't believe?

Every single poster on this board has a personal bias based on their own particular belief levels and criteria for believing something.
Most posters on this board believe they have sought the Lord and have got the truth from him, even though He told them something different to what He tells you.
All you are doing is asserting that you are right and others are wrong for no justifiable reason.

[_Franktalk]

Bazooka,

When your bias is to let God speak to you as you read then you are likely to receive something close to God's message. But when your bias is to use your own tools of reasoning there is little chance of receiving the message.

Of course you will use those same tools of personal reasoning to disagree with me. I have been through this with almost countless people. Yet I still have hope for others.

[_Franktalk]

Fusion,

I enjoyed your post. I am going to meet with my Bishop and let him know what is going on. I have no desire to leave the church but the church may have the desire to kick me out. It is what it is. It all centers around multiple probations for me. How silly it is that something that matters not in the least the church has raised to a level to remove believing members.

[_Bazooka]

Bazooka,

When your bias is to let God speak to you as you read then you are likely to receive something close to God's message. But when your bias is to use your own tools of reasoning there is little chance of receiving the message.

Of course you will use those same tools of personal reasoning to disagree with me. I have been through this with almost countless people. Yet I still have hope for others.

Franktalk, I'm really not disagreeing with you.

All I am saying is that, no matter how hard an individual tries, personal bias will always enter into the process when relying on ones 'feelings' and 'impressions' of what God is or isn't saying.

[_Albion]

Bazooka, you make a valid point but I fear you are wasting your time trying to press it with Tobin and Franktalk. They know nothing of my spiritual journey, how I arrived where I am, but make wild assumptions that only they have found the formula to understanding. My views are based on prayerful study of God's word as it is contained in his word, the Bible...God's word which at times they have referred to "baloney" or mere words. They are both out in left field when it comes to Biblical theology, drawing from any source that appears to support their own particular belief system and seemingly denying the apparent core beliefs of Christianity. They are even both clearly misfits within their own claimed belief system of Mormonism and yet brand me as "relying on one's feelings and impressions". That really is rich coming from those mired in a belief system that calls upon its adherents to trust their feelings as verification of truth. I much prefer the facts of God's word.

[_Franktalk]

Franktalk, I'm really not disagreeing with you.

All I am saying is that, no matter how hard an individual tries, personal bias will always enter into the process when relying on ones 'feelings' and 'impressions' of what God is or isn't saying.

I am sorry I was so blunt. What you say it true. We have to train ourselves to get our own ego out of the way before we can hear. No matter how hard we try we will still screw it up and receive almost what is given. It is the nature of the flesh. Even those who are strong in the spirit may disagree with each other on issues. Normally small issues but disagreements none the less. And each one will be tempered with personal bias. We can not escape it.

When Jesus walked the earth the people standing in front of Him received a very clear message. Yet not all followed what He said. But those who have their spirits touched seem to be even more able to follow Him. So manifestation and clarity is not the path but direct spiritual communication seems to be. I think we are being trained as spirits in this body so when we receive our new bodies we can still be the spirit that we are.