LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

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_Darth J
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LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _Darth J »

Since not-a-cafeteria-Mormon Nelson Chung, bcspace, and others remind everyone so much that one can totally reject the doctrine of a global flood, accept the theory of evolution, and yet still be in complete harmony with the revealed truths of the restored gospel, I though it would be fun to review a few things that are false if the global flood doctrine is not true, the Tower of Babel story is not true, and/or evolution is true. Anyone, feel free to add to this list:

--the need for a savior from physical death
--the plausibility that the extraterrestrial demigod Elohim, who lived out his mortal life on another planet, is a primate just like the humans who evolved according to the specific conditions of this planet
--the Doctrine and Covenants
--the Book of Mormon
--the Book of Abraham
--the Book of Moses
--the idea that the current leaders of the LDS Church can understand the difference between their personal beliefs/opinions and truths revealed from God
--the idea that past Mormon leaders could understand the difference between their personal beliefs/ideas and truths revealed from God
--the need for a savior from sin, since there would have been no Fall if human beings had been living, reproducing, and dying for thousands of years before Adam and Eve allegedly left the Garden of Eden
--the idea of a pure Adamic language that Joseph Smith taught
--the idea of the priesthood being a patriarchal order that started with Adam
--the Mormon doctrine that prior to the Second Coming, all the Saints will meet at Adam-ondi-ahman to link priesthood keys back to Adam (see above)
--the doctrine that Adam-ondi-ahman has any basis in reality (the LDS Church owns the land and has placards identifying it as Adam-ondi-ahman, and the D&C contains a revelation identifying that area as Adam-ondi-ahman)
--Joseph F. Smith's vision of the redemption of the dead that was canonized in the D&C, which confirms that everyone on Earth except the passengers on Noah's ark died in a global flood
--the doctrine of human existence being divided into priesthood dispensations that began with Adam
--the doctrine that marriage is a divine institution that Elohim initiated in the Garden of Eden, as opposed to marriage being a human-created social and legal construct
--the doctrine that Adam and Eve were given a choice to experience mortality and death, which is the closest thing to a theodicy Mormonism offers (suffering happens because of free agency and because we need to experience it to become gods, as opposed to suffering and death just being things that arise out of nature)
--the doctrine that all living things were created spiritually before they were created physically (why would an organism spiritually exist forever in a form adapted to conditions of a specific environment and time on Earth?)

Anyway, there is a start. Just some minor, tangential things that are not central to the message of the restored gospel.
_honorentheos
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _honorentheos »

The belief that the earth possesses intelligence, is fallen, was baptized, and will be renewed and receive it's paradisiacal glory. Because these things are necessary parts of the plan of salvation for humans as they are of "spheres".
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_bcspace
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _bcspace »

Since not-a-cafeteria-Mormon Nelson Chung, bcspace, and others remind everyone so much that one can totally reject the doctrine of a global flood, accept the theory of evolution, and yet still be in complete harmony with the revealed truths of the restored gospel,


I have never said that. While I don't believe I am wrong about the global Food actually being local, I certainly could be wrong. In addition, there is no conflict with LDS doctrine and evolution.

Anyone, feel free to add to this list:


Apples to oranges. You are proposing harmony by rejecting such things whereas I freely admit I am out of harmony by rejecting the global Flood doctrine. Huge difference.
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_Darth J
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _Darth J »

bcspace wrote:
Since not-a-cafeteria-Mormon Nelson Chung, bcspace, and others remind everyone so much that one can totally reject the doctrine of a global flood, accept the theory of evolution, and yet still be in complete harmony with the revealed truths of the restored gospel,


I have never said that. While I don't believe I am wrong about the global Food actually being local, I certainly could be wrong. In addition, there is no conflict with LDS doctrine and evolution.


And neither is there any conflict between LDS doctrine and promiscuous gay sex. Also, the Church has no official position as to whether Joseph Smith was a prophet.

Anyone, feel free to add to this list:


Apples to oranges. You are proposing harmony by rejecting such things whereas I freely admit I am out of harmony by rejecting the global Flood doctrine. Huge difference.


I am not proposing harmony. I am listing things that are necessarily also wrong if the global flood is wrong and evolution is true.
_honorentheos
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _honorentheos »

bcspace wrote: While I don't believe I am wrong about the global Food actually being local, I certainly could be wrong.

Is this some sort of stealth marketing campaign for Whole Foods?
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
_Tobin
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _Tobin »

honorentheos wrote:
bcspace wrote: While I don't believe I am wrong about the global Food actually being local, I certainly could be wrong.

Is this some sort of stealth marketing campaign for Whole Foods?

I think so, later he mentions apples and oranges.
"You lack vision, but I see a place where people get on and off the freeway. On and off, off and on all day, all night.... Tire salons, automobile dealerships and wonderful, wonderful billboards reaching as far as the eye can see. My God, it'll be beautiful." -- Judge Doom
_bcspace
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _bcspace »

And now you know why the spell checker didn't catch it. "Food" is a perfectly cromulent word.
Machina Sublime
Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
Your Best Resource On Joseph Smith's Polygamy.
Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
_honorentheos
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _honorentheos »

bcspace wrote:And now you know why the spell checker didn't catch it. "Food" is a perfectly cromulent word.

I'm still wondering why you capitalized it, though. Lower case "global", upper case "Food/Flood"? Unless you were emphasizing the word in which case local, global, and Food in the same sentence seems pretty suspicious to me... :wink:
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
_Yoda

Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _Yoda »

Darth wrote:--the need for a savior from physical death


Could you please explain how discounting the global flood and accepting evolution means that this is not true?
_LDSToronto
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Re: LDS things that are false if cafeteria Mo's are right

Post by _LDSToronto »

Yoda wrote:
Darth wrote:--the need for a savior from physical death


Could you please explain how discounting the global flood and accepting evolution means that this is not true?


If evolution is accepted, it means there was no created man - no Adam. And therefore, no Fall. Thus, no need for an atonement.

H.
"Others cannot endure their own littleness unless they can translate it into meaningfulness on the largest possible level."
~ Ernest Becker
"Whether you think of it as heavenly or as earthly, if you love life immortality is no consolation for death."
~ Simone de Beauvoir
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