How was your mother's talk? How did you feel hearing her give voice to some of the LDS mantras in a public, LDS meeting?
My mom is a wonderful person, so I'm biased in her favor. Like me, she was a convert to the church. Unlike me, she stuck with it. Her talk was about how the gospel has changed her life since her conversion 38 years ago. She emphasized the community support that Mormonism gives, which has been helpful to her since the death of my dad last year. I do think she overstated some things due to the LDS lens, but that's par for the course. And, like most active Mormons, she overlooked how potentially offensive some of her comments were to those who do not share her faith. For example, my niece was raised LDS but left as an adult and became a liberal Episcopalian. She has always been very supportive and loving to my mom and was in the audience with us. But mom had to make a dig about how Mormonism clarified the notion of god from some weirdo trinity mess to two separate gods with bodies. I actually jabbed my niece with my elbow and whispered "take that" at that part, but she just good-naturedly smiled and shrugged.
I was just happy she didn't want to talk in detail about her talk afterwards. It's better just to avoid the subject. We just told her she did a great job, which she did. (much more interesting than the GA, in my biased opinion)
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.
Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:Well, you should know after spending so much time here that having your name removed is really about taking back control of your life symbolically. You give so much to this cult that it feels good to take something back from them. Ideally, when you have your name removed they don't actually count you among their flock any more... Although I have a feeling they still do. Regardless, it feels empowering to make a point to someone in 'authority' within the Church.
- Doc
Absolutely. I felt very strongly that I did not want my name to be associated with the LDS church, and I also did not want my children constantly pestered. In addition, I rightly suspected the only way my family would accept my total apostasy from the church was to have my name removed. That was the only way they would also stop pestering me.
I do think the only reason I kept being contacted after having my name removed AND requesting no contact was due to the fact that my children were still listed on rolls, along with my contact information. I was never rude to anyone who called, but it took me a while to figure out why my name was still on anything.
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.
Quasimodo wrote:My wife's grandmother did the same thing. After passing 90 and recovering from a broken hip, she would walk uphill for two blocks to attend church at the Ventura Mission every day.
I used to think "Are there no soap operas? Are there no game shows?" I found it odd, but I had to admire her devotion. She was a great lady and I never brought up the subject of religion with her nor she with me.
Your wife's grandmother probably was able to pass 90 because she would walk uphill for two blocks instead of watching soap operas.
M.
I'd rather be a could-be if I cannot be an are; because a could-be is a maybe who - is reaching for a star. I'd rather be a has-been than a might-have-been, by far; for a might have-been has never been, but a has was once an are. - Milton Berle
You know, this occurred to me as well. I think that the difference is that the repetitive nature of the ceremony, in catholicism, is celebrated and clothed in other sacred acts that trigger the other senses. The smell of the incense, the art, the clothing, the real chanting - it's the whole point. Whereas in Mormonism, the repetitive nature is accidental. Each speaker imagines he/she is sharing something personal, unique, when actually is it prepackaged and boring.
The smell of incense is basically done during high mass. Most masses do not have it. The chanting depends on the mass. The old latin mass has much more chanting. But usually there is no chanting duirng the more modern catholic mass with the exception of the high mass at times. The repetitive nature of the catholic mass is certainly not accidental as you just stated. However, in Mormonism there are lay people who must perform some service such as give talks and teach lessons. Not everyone is trained in such duties and most are rather limited in what they have to say. The catholic priest is paid for his services or is supported the parishioners and has received years of training in seminary school etc.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
beastie wrote: Absolutely. I felt very strongly that I did not want my name to be associated with the LDS church, and I also did not want my children constantly pestered. In addition, I rightly suspected the only way my family would accept my total apostasy from the church was to have my name removed. That was the only way they would also stop pestering me.
Interestingly, when some members are not 'pestered' they claim to be ignored and unloved. Lets just say that they weren't pestering you but rather attempting to show you love so that you would return.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
why me wrote:Interestingly, when some members are not 'pestered' they claim to be ignored and unloved. Lets just say that they weren't pestering you but rather attempting to show you love so that you would return.
That's called 'creepy' when it's unwarranted and unwanted. What's wrong with you?
- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.
Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
why me wrote:Interestingly, when some members are not 'pestered' they claim to be ignored and unloved. Lets just say that they weren't pestering you but rather attempting to show you love so that you would return.
That's called 'creepy' when it's unwarranted and unwanted. What's wrong with you?
- Doc
Unwittingly, 'why me' nails it. They want you to return. That's it. They don't show you love unconditionally.
It makes them feel better about themselves, it helps them feel right.
“When we are confronted with evidence that challenges our deeply held beliefs we are more likely to reframe the evidence than we are to alter our beliefs. We simply invent new reasons, new justifications, new explanations. Sometimes we ignore the evidence altogether.” (Mathew Syed 'Black Box Thinking')
