The First Plastic First Family

[_Jersey Girl]

This incident as noted by David Packman and others here and here is the strongest indication I have yet seen of that.

No, just no, Gunnar. The first bit about her frowning, you can't see who he's talking to. The gentleman (SIL?) behind her is listening to him speak as well. I have no idea why she smiled and then changed expression and neither do you. I'm not willing to watch one snippet of video that intentionally features a close up of Melania without seeing who else is reacting to his words and how they reacted.


The second about him walking ahead of her into the White House, here's the entire film of that arrival. Watch it carefully, because the clip you presented above is obviously edited to influence you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_maQ44FQ4qQ

So do you think you can fully trust this Packman guy?

Here, Gunnar. Here's a full clip of the changing facial expression. This happened during prayer. You can clearly see that her face is solemn BEFORE Trump does anything. He turns to her when the Rev. Graham makes a little joke about the rain. He turns back, and her face goes solemn again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPPz2F5Me24

What you are seeing there is reverence, not an abused woman.

Gunnar,

These videos are being edited for the express purpose of portraying people in such a way as to influence the public and manipulate public opinion. So far, it's working. I see them come up in my Facebook feed on a daily basis. I always look for another source or view or transcript of the same event to try to separate truth from fiction.

Some guys on an old board, who told me I was cherry picking things out of context and compartmentalizing, and talked to me about confirmation bias and critical thinking, taught me to do that. And, they told me the burden of proof was on me.

There is my proof that the videos you presented are false representations, cherry picked out of context to fool the public, to manipulate and confirm bias.

[_Gunnar]

Here, Gunnar. Here's a full clip of the changing facial expression. This happened during prayer. You can clearly see that her face is solemn BEFORE Trump does anything. He turns to her when the Rev. Graham makes a little joke about the rain. He turns back, and her face goes solemn again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPPz2F5Me24

What you are seeing there is reverence, not an abused woman.

You may be right about that one. She looked solemn before he turned to her, and he was clearly smiling as he turned to her, and she seemed to smile in response to whatever he was saying, and resumed her previous solemn expression after he turned back. It is a bit hard to see how to justify that the only reasonable conclusion is that she was being verbally abused without knowing what he actually said.

[_Jersey Girl]

Watch the other video of them arriving at the White House. The reason I knew the video was edited in order to manipulate, was because one of my Facebook friends posted it and I looked for a video of the whole arrival. One criticism is that Trump left "poor Melania" to exit the car on her own. I dug up the video of President Elect Obama's arrival at the White House on his inauguration day, and Mrs. Obama exits the car in the exact same way.

As to the assertion in question that Trump went ahead of his wife and left her behind, you can clearly see that President Obama is the one who put his hand on Trump to guide him to go first, likely for the express purpose of White House photographers who were standing ready to photograph his first entrance into the White House. Then, everyone changes positions and goes in together. No one is "leaving Melania behind" as the edited videos suggest.

There is a reason these videos are being edited in the way that they are and it has nothing to do with truth.

[_Gunnar]

I have to agree with you, Jersey Girl. There is enough horrible stuff about Trump that no one needs to make up stuff about him to make him look bad. Doing so will only tend to undermine the real case against him.

[_Choyo Chagas]

history is repeating itself

Trump:

Trump married his first wife, Czech model Ivana Zelníčková

Trump's troubled marriage to Ivana and affair with actress Marla Maples

In 1998, Trump began a relationship with Slovene model Melania Knauss, who became his third wife.

model-actress-model...
a man marrying by watching the display windows

ivana zelníčková:

In 1971, Zelníčková married real estate agent Alfred Winklmayr. They divorced in 1973. She left Czechoslovakia for Canada to be with a childhood friend, George Syrovatka, who owned a ski boutique there. For the following two years, she lived in Montreal, improved her English by taking night courses at McGill University[citation needed], and worked as a model for some of Canada's top fur companies. Zelníčková then left Syrovatka and moved to New York to promote the Montreal Olympics.
In New York, Zelníčková met Donald Trump

marla maples:

She met Donald Trump in 1989 and had a highly publicized relationship with at least one breakup. The press coverage – the New York Post would have Trump appear on its cover for eight days in a row, once with a quote from Maples claiming that he provided the "best sex I've ever had" – amazed Trump, and it distinguished Maples from the many other women rumored to be dating him.

melanija knavs:

After moving to New York City in 1996, Melania met her future husband Donald at a Fashion Week party in New York City in September 1998. He and Marla Maples had separated in May 1997; divorce proceedings were finalized on June 8, 1999. Donald attended the event with another date, Celina Midelfart, and Melania initially refused to give Donald her phone number. Melania broke off the relationship shortly after it began, but the couple reconciled after a few months. Their relationship gained attention after a 1999 interview on The Howard Stern Show.

women marrying by wallets

then, the history... not parallel but similarities...
Claudius (/ˈklɔːdiəs/; Latin: Tiberius Claudius Caesar Augustus Germanicus;
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claudius -
from there:

Marriages and personal life
Suetonius and the other ancient authors accused Claudius of being dominated by women and wives, and of being a womanizer.
Plautia Urgulanilla... see wiki
Aelia Paetina... see wiki
Valeria Messalina...

The ancient historians allege that Messalina was a nymphomaniac who was regularly unfaithful to Claudius — Tacitus states she went so far as to compete with a prostitute to see who could have the most sexual partners in a night — and manipulated his policies in order to amass wealth. In 48, Messalina married her lover Gaius Silius in a public ceremony while Claudius was at Ostia.

Agrippina the Younger...

Claudius did marry once more. The ancient sources tell that his freedmen put forward three candidates, Caligula's third wife Lollia Paulina, Claudius's divorced second wife Aelia Paetina and Claudius's niece Agrippina the Younger. According to Suetonius, Agrippina won out through her feminine wiles.
...
The truth is probably more political

not a true parallel; but think about, if you can

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

For what it's worth my two daughters gave less than two **** about the First Lady. They seemed to be interested in pop culture and their friends, though.

- Doc

Good for them. But they are a non-random sample of two, right?

They are. I have a feeling if my kids, when they were ~14 & 11-years-old respectively, had been asked the following questions about the First Lady it would've gone like this:

Me: Hey, I have some questions I'd like to ask you about the First Lady

The Older One: The who?

Me: The First Lady. She's the President's wife.

The Younger One: *stares at us with a blank expression*

The Older One: Oooookay, why are you doing this?

Me: It's not important. So, what is the First Lady's name?

The Younger One: *laughs nervously* Mumbles, "I don't know...", looks at sister because she usually knows some things.

The Older One: I thiiiiiink it's, wait, no, yeah, it's Michelle Obama, right? Well. Wait. Is it Michelle Obama, right? *laughs maniacally* I don't knoooooooow! Why are you doing this to us?

Me: That's her first and last name, but yeah, it's Michell Obama. Good job.

Me: Last question.

The Older One: Okaaaaaay?

The Younger One: *stares at us with a blank expression*

Me: Does Michelle Obama inspire you or in any way, shape, or form affect your self-esteem or how you choose to live your life?

The Older One: Daaaaaaaad.

The Younger One: *stares at us nervously*

Me: Okay, just play along. I have a stupid argument I'm witnessing on the Internet and I want to give my two cents.

The Older One: I guess. No. Probably not. I mean, she's the First Lady, but no, not really. I just kind of do my own thing. She really doesn't. Dad, this is stupid.

Me: I know. Hey, *The Younger One*, does the First Lady impact you or your life at all?

The Younger One: *laughs nervously* Noooo.

Me: Thanks, guys. Go away. Go clean your room. Stop hovering. Do your homework. Shoo.

- Doc

[_Some Schmo]

Anecdotally, my mom had a face lift and my sister a boob job. Both said they wanted to do it to because it would make them feel better about themselves. They didn't do it to impress anyone else.

I don't doubt they think this, but I believe they are kidding themselves.

It's not a choice I would make, but I don't judge them for doing it.

I'm not critical of people getting plastic surgery either, but I think we should be honest about the reasons.

If you were burned horribly in a fire and were getting skin grafts, that would be one thing. Or perhaps it's a breast reduction to help with back pain. These are valid means to feeling better about yourself. But if you're doing it for a cosmetic improvement, there's no point trying to hide what you're doing there. Why would you feel better about yourself if you weren't getting positive feedback about it? Did they do it so they could look at themselves in the mirror without freaking out?

[Guest]

Anecdotally, my mom had a face lift and my sister a boob job. Both said they wanted to do it to because it would make them feel better about themselves. They didn't do it to impress anyone else.

I don't doubt they think this, but I believe they are kidding themselves.

what a shame they did not counsel with you - can't imagine why not

It's not a choice I would make, but I don't judge them for doing it.

I'm not critical of people getting plastic surgery either, but I think we should be honest about the reasons.

How about being honest with the notion that you are not the fountainhead of why people do stuff...what authority are you claiming to be the guy who gets to decide that RI's mom/sister aren't being honest? What magic power do you have to understand their motivation? Aside from just calling them a liar because of some narcissistic high-ground you imagine you occupy, perhaps the "honesty" here is that you are imposing your own sense of self upon others that may not share the same shallow reason that "you" would get plastic surgery.
But what do i know? we should all sit back and let you tell us the truth for doing what we do.

If you were burned horribly in a fire and were getting skin grafts, that would be one thing.

one thing that you would approve of? one thing that you would judge as being appropriate because of your own view of how people with burnt skin should accommodate your self-righteous sensibilities?

Or perhaps it's a breast reduction to help with back pain. These are valid means to feeling better about yourself.

"valid"? - wtf happened to "i don't judge them..."? or "I'm not critical of people getting plastic surgery either"? (you literally just wrote those sentences)
Let us all gather around and let you tell what is and what is not a valid means for feeling better about ourselves....i can't believe i have been such a schmuck by thinking that i knew what was valid in my own life.
Thanks schmo, i will bet that none of these ladies present realized that you, as a man, knew what was "valid" with regards to female breasts.
Thank goodness that mansplaining is only for Republicans or you would be coming across as a real wanker at this point

But if you're doing it for a cosmetic improvement, there's no point trying to hide what you're doing there. Why would you feel better about yourself if you weren't getting positive feedback about it? Did they do it so they could look at themselves in the mirror without freaking out?

I feel bad, because i always thought "schmo" just meant "stupid person" or "ordinary person" - but apparently it also means "jerk".

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Let me tell you something. If Big Pharma developed a safe and reliable pill that eliminated obesity/fatty deposits and encouraged lean muscle mass development all these Health at Every Size Love Muh Cuuuuuurves would be thin.

All of 'em.

They'd tell you they'd do it for themselves, they just want to feel whatever, but let me tell you... They'd do it to look hotter.

The idea that people get plastic surgery not because they want to look better and to be evaluated by others more favorably is “F” ing laughable.

- Doc

[_The CCC]

The problem with the "good guy with a gun" concept is that actual law enforcement, coming upon the chaos of a shooting, cannot easily determine which gun wielder is the "good guy". "Good guys" are not necessarily good or accurate shots, either. LEO may be as likely to shoot the vigilantes as the original criminal, and the more crossfire, the more danger to bystanders.

All of this can be true, absolutely. There are risks to carrying concealed and making a decision to draw and get involved. I've taken classes from experts (former military special forces, law enforcement, etc) they talk about this specifically - what to do after getting involved and how not to get shot by cops. So yes, there are risks, and carrying concealed isn't for everyone. In a nutshell, I'd rather have a choice if ever put in that situation, rather than just being another victim and expecting someone to come save me.

Cops don't see a good guy with a gun. What they see is a guy with a gun. Let's get real here instead of some wild west fantasy. It is you that be laying there is a pool of your own blood, "But officer I was a good guy with a gun".