Another Coffee Post

[Guest]

It may be hot, but since science will have been rejected in Mormon heaven (and no doubt relegated to Mormon hell), I'll bet we could start a side business making and selling A/C units.

Except hell isn't hot in Mormonism. It's God that dwells in everlasting burnings. Hell has an absence of light (and therefore heat).

Once everyone had a pleasant place to work, we could use all of the rejected science to build a really nice environment.

You're sounding an awful lot like Joseph Smith...

Hey JLHPROF,

You clearly generate and enjoy your own religious fantasies. Are we not entitled to do the same?

When I was a kid an operative Mormon meme about the three kingdoms went something like this:

If you could see the Telestial Kingdom you would kill to get in (or was it "do anything" to get in?).

If you could see the Celestial Kingdom you would never sin again.

[_Lemmie]

The WoW is something that the Church has overemphasized that the critics love to rag on. But the second you point out that the emphasis hasn't always been there the same critics like to mock that. Mocked for following, mocked for once not following.

You are incorrectly concluding that this discussion of the inconsistencies in the religion is the equivalent of the members being mocked.

the second you point out that the emphasis hasn't always been there

Which version of the lds religion across time do you consider to be the one that the Mormon god believes in?

Meanwhile, all those exalted folks in Mormon heaven could continue to attend church, do exactly what all of the prophets who end up there tell them to do, and enjoy their burning bosoms.

You do have a way with words, DrW!

[_JLHPROF]

Which version of the lds religion across time do you consider to be the one that the Mormon god believes in?

The one Joseph Smith restored and Brigham Young systematized.

[_moksha]

If you believe that it's the coffee itself that is a hindrance to exaltation I think you may have missed something.

So it's an obedience test?

- Doc

No. It is a ridiculous idea that you can vote a proposed health code as a holy mandate. Any talk of an obedience test against beverages like coffee and tea is an exercise in superciliousness. Best to observe those parts that really do jive with medical science such very limited use of alcohol and no tobacco products.

[_Lemmie]

Which version of the lds religion across time do you consider to be the one that the Mormon god believes in?

The one Joseph Smith restored and Brigham Young systematized.

Interesting. If it's not too personal of a question, since you don't believe in the SLC lds version, what religious sect, if any, are you a member of?

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

So it's an obedience test?

Perhaps.

Perhaps not even that.

If it were a requirement for the Celestial Kingdom then none of the first 6 prophets of the Church (nor many of the GA's of that era) will make the Celestial Kingdom.

Unless you mean obedience to our priesthood head (instead of the WoW).

In which case, yes, it is a test of obedience.

So clear. So inspiring. So truthy.

Welp, I hope you're not paying tithing, or at least a full tithe, because it's also completely unnecessary for exaltation.

- Doc

[_cwald]

Do faithful Mormons believe drinking coffee will keep them out of the Celestial Kingdom?

I certainly hope they don't (but people believe all kinds of things).

Drinking coffee can keep you from receiving a temple recommend at this point in Church history which would prevent you from receiving exalting ordinances. Baptism being the only one required for entrance into the Celestial Kingdom and not too many 8 year olds drinking coffee probably limits it further.

But even that has only been the case for about 1/2 the Church's existence. All those early coffee drinking saints didn't seem too worried about losing out on exaltation.

Right.

This is the type of double speak and dishonesty that led me out of the church.

[_Lemmie]

Do faithful Mormons believe drinking coffee will keep them out of the Celestial Kingdom?

I certainly hope they don't (but people believe all kinds of things).

Drinking coffee can keep you from receiving a temple recommend at this point in Church history which would prevent you from receiving exalting ordinances. Baptism being the only one required for entrance into the Celestial Kingdom and not too many 8 year olds drinking coffee probably limits it further.

But even that has only been the case for about 1/2 the Church's existence. All those early coffee drinking saints didn't seem too worried about losing out on exaltation.

Right.

This is the type of double speak and dishonesty that led me out of the church.

Exactly.

[_AmyJo]

It does work for all kinds of policies. In Moses day there were hundred of commandments, then Christ managed to convey the same principles with a different focus and teachings.

Moses nor the Israelites recognized J. Christ as their Lord and God. That would be pagan and idolatry for a Jew to idolize any mortal being posing as God. Christ himself did not hold himself up to God or usurp God's authority over him. Christ was also a lifelong Jew who followed rabbinical teachings and the Torah, same as Moses and the ancient Israelites.

The commandments you're referring to are the mitzvot found in the Torah and the Talmud. Not the teachings of J. Christ. The Jews worship only One God, the Abrahamaic God. There are no other gods before him or after.

But it's hardly a hazing. The WoW is something that the Church has overemphasized that the critics love to rag on. But the second you point out that the emphasis hasn't always been there the same critics like to mock that. Mocked for following, mocked for once not following. Obedience to our file leader has always been a higher commandment than any principle in the WoW.

That's blind obedience. It's a dereliction of personal responsibility to abdicate one's personal stewardship to follow a pagan and false prophet to one's folly.

If following the leader is always the higher commandment, that goes in line with doubting your doubts for your thinking has already been done for you.

What you describe is the hallmark of a cult. Pray, pay, obey, and submit. Emphasis on relation with the church (cult) hierarchy, not with the Creator.

[_Quasimodo]

...

On the bright side, you, Z and I could form a partnership and open a Starbucks franchise in hell. It would be hot working conditions, but I bet it would be a money maker.

I suspect you would be the leading Starbucks in iced coffees and smoothies.