please, put your presuppositions and prejudice to the side and explain 2 simple points: 1. why those how are profiting off the pursuit would necessarily not be looking for ethical boundaries? (which I assume these boundaries must be as you define them to be and not as they may define them). 2. Why you assume ethical boundaries exist in that context?
Answering with questions again, subbie? How does one ethic? Can one epistemology on the head of a pin? Is the tower of pancakes breakfast special really a good deal just because it's cheaper than the omelet?
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth? ~ Eiji Yoshikawa
Honor, you crack me up. You are taking subbie to the woodshed (which in my mind you have every right to do) but I'm a little pissed now that I took so seriously your very public admonition last year that the way I responded to mentalgymnast was ultimately only a bad reflection on me.
I took your post to heart and spent quite a bit of fairly anguished time reflecting on your comments, as well as thinking long and hard about my still oppressive Mormon gut reaction that was telling me I had no choice but to listen to men who tell women how to behave.
And now here you are! You clearly feel as strongly about refuting subbie's nonsense as I felt about dismantling mentalgymnast's crap. Is it because your assessment of subbie as a troll is more real to you than was my assessment that mentalgymnast was a similar troll? Or maybe it was because mentalgymnast was a little better at pretending he was here only as a TBM, and, as our newest mod put it, we need to stop driving the Mormons away?
What if subbie played the TBM card? Would you be fooled by his trolling then?
By all means, carry on. Far be it from me to tell another poster how they should or should not express their opinion.
I have noticed that Mental hasn't been totally-not-apologist'ing lately. Did Lemmie vanquish the pied piper of poor apoogetics?
- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.
Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
Lemmie wrote:Honor, you crack me up. You are taking subbie to the woodshed (which in my mind you have every right to do) but I'm a little pissed now that I took so seriously your very public admonition last year that the way I responded to mentalgymnast was ultimately only a bad reflection on me.
I took your post to heart and spent quite a bit of fairly anguished time reflecting on your comments, as well as thinking long and hard about my still oppressive Mormon gut reaction that was telling me I had no choice but to listen to men who tell women how to behave.
And now here you are! You clearly feel as strongly about refuting subbie's nonsense as I felt about dismantling mentalgymnast's crap. Is it because your assessment of subbie as a troll is more real to you than was my assessment that mentalgymnast was a similar troll? Or maybe it was because mentalgymnast was a little better at pretending he was here only as a TBM, and, as our newest mod put it, we need to stop driving the Mormons away?
What if subbie played the TBM card? Would you be fooled by his trolling then?
By all means, carry on. Far be it from me to tell another poster how they should or should not express their opinion.
Hi Lemmie,
That's a fair critique and one I don't have an answer for that isn't a self-justification. If I were to say what I thought about subbie it's that I probably fail but do try to accept something EA once said about meeting someone that one believes to be disingenuous with a sincere and factual reply but clearly the post above is not that. It's just me feeling that after supplying his CFR on "evidence" for something that is only a possibility which I viewed as a silly request but tried to respond to seriously that this deviation into further rhetorical posturing about ethics was just that. But that proves your point that I perhaps should have listened to my better angels which were telling me to just ignore his post. I don't know.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth? ~ Eiji Yoshikawa
That's a fair critique and one I don't have an answer for that isn't a self-justification. If I were to say what I thought about subbie it's that I probably fail but do try to accept something EA once said about meeting someone that one believes to be disingenuous with a sincere and factual reply but clearly the post above is not that. It's just me feeling that after supplying his CFR on "evidence" for something that is only a possibility which I viewed as a silly request but tried to respond to seriously that this deviation into further rhetorical posturing about ethics was just that. But that proves your point that I perhaps should have listened to my better angels which were telling me to just ignore his post. I don't know.
Fair enough. I tried many a time to respond appropriately to mentalgymnast, but he resisted all efforts also.
By the way, I read over my message and I didn't mean to imply that I thought you as a man were telling me as a woman how to behave, only that my well-trained TBM indoctrination was interpreting it that way. Bottom line, I always felt I responded to mentalgymnast in keeping with the way he posted. I regret having made others uncomfortable if I did that, but I don't regret, AT ALL, pointing out his trolling techniques. His hiding behind his TBM status was a technique he used to disguise his trolling, and he took advantage of that apparent status here with great success.
honorentheos wrote:Google A.I. is interesting and has been in the news recently due to their employees speaking out against work they are doing for the US military. My understanding is that it had to do with drones and recognition software, and the employees speaking out weren't cool with their working on something that will be used to help the government target and kill people. So there are ethical demands being made by people working on it at least when it comes to traditional questions such as state-sanctioned killing of human beings. But the flip side is that the company took that contract and was/is more than willing to do that work.
One problem I see is that other groups like the Russians and Chinese are pursuing the same technologies. Should the US not pursue it if the Russians and Chinese continue doing so?
honorentheos wrote:Google A.I. is interesting and has been in the news recently due to their employees speaking out against work they are doing for the US military. My understanding is that it had to do with drones and recognition software, and the employees speaking out weren't cool with their working on something that will be used to help the government target and kill people. So there are ethical demands being made by people working on it at least when it comes to traditional questions such as state-sanctioned killing of human beings. But the flip side is that the company took that contract and was/is more than willing to do that work.
One problem I see is that other groups like the Russians and Chinese are pursuing the same technologies. Should the US not pursue it if the Russians and Chinese continue doing so?
There is a "tragedy of the commons" trap in this that seems almost unavoidable.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth? ~ Eiji Yoshikawa
That's a fair critique and one I don't have an answer for that isn't a self-justification. If I were to say what I thought about subbie it's that I probably fail but do try to accept something EAllusion once said about meeting someone that one believes to be disingenuous with a sincere and factual reply but clearly the post above is not that. It's just me feeling that after supplying his CFR on "evidence" for something that is only a possibility which I viewed as a silly request but tried to respond to seriously that this deviation into further rhetorical posturing about ethics was just that. But that proves your point that I perhaps should have listened to my better angels which were telling me to just ignore his post. I don't know.
Fair enough. I tried many a time to respond appropriately to mentalgymnast, but he resisted all efforts also.
By the way, I read over my message and I didn't mean to imply that I thought you as a man were telling me as a woman how to behave, only that my well-trained TBM indoctrination was interpreting it that way. Bottom line, I always felt I responded to mentalgymnast in keeping with the way he posted. I regret having made others uncomfortable if I did that, but I don't regret, AT ALL, pointing out his trolling techniques. His hiding behind his TBM status was a technique he used to disguise his trolling, and he took advantage of that apparent status here with great success.
Hi Lemmie -
Again, these are all fair points. I apologize that my comments then took a personal tone when they should not have.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth? ~ Eiji Yoshikawa
