Iowa governor signs abortion regulation

[_Markk]

What types of things do you do in real life to improve the life circumstances of children?

What does that have to do with my view...are you saying that if I did not help those born in a unfortunate circumstance...I have no right to believe taking a child's life is wrong?

Again you are just proving my point about the two larger positions.

I have done many things for children in need, or just children in general...probably more than most, but far less than some.

[_Jersey Girl]

What types of things do you do in real life to improve the life circumstances of children?

What does that have to do with my view...are you saying that if I did not help those born in a unfortunate circumstance...I have no right to believe taking a child's life is wrong?

Yes, I am.

Again you are just proving my point about the two larger positions.

I have done many things for children in need, or just children in general...probably more than most, but far less than some.

Like what?

[_EAllusion]

"Human life" isn't really what the abortion debate is about and immediately cedes the argument to the pro-life crowd as an embryo is clearly a "human life." A brain dead vegetable on life support is a "human life" too.

Normally, abortion is thought to concern "personhood," which in this context means being something that deserves moral respect. It may be the case that things that count as "human lives," such as embryos or the brain dead aren't persons and things that aren't "human lives," such as intelligent alien life or higher order primates could be thought of as persons. In fact, an overwhelming majority of philosophers of ethics think just that.

It's actually extremely hard to justify a 7 week old fetus as a thing that deserves moral rights. By assuming anything that counts as a human life qualifies as a person, you assume an argument that otherwise is extraordinarily difficult to make, which is why pro-life defenders generally don't bother trying to defend it or crash and burn like a middle-schooler in over their head when they do.

[_Markk]

Yes, I am.

Again you are just proving my point about the two larger positions.

I have done many things for children in need, or just children in general...probably more than most, but far less than some.

Like what?

I am okay with my stance on this Jersey Girl...I don't need to justify it....if you believe that hurt and bad feelings justify taking a life, you can life with that.

[_Jersey Girl]

if you believe that hurt and bad feelings justify taking a life, you can life with that.

QUOTE the post where I took that position.

[_Markk]

if you believe that hurt and bad feelings justify taking a life, you can life with that.

QUOTE the post where I took that position.

You wrote "...Why are you giving me a choice between the feelings vs the life of a person? Are you implying that both can't be equally important?..."

If they are equally important to you, and when one chooses an abortion becasue of feelings,you appear to support that choice. And I can only assume that those feelings would be hurt and bad feelings, if I am wrong what kind of feelings are you talking about...I doubt you would mean because of good feelings?

This is not an easy issue to discuss or sort out, I get that...and I know it is not a black and white issue to most when broken down honestly with either position/s.

[_Themis]

What are more important, the feelings of a person, or the life of a person?

In what way is a fetus a person?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Person

[_Markk]

What are more important, the feelings of a person, or the life of a person?

In what way is a fetus a person?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Person

LOL Wikipedia on a definition of a person written by a random unnamed developed human fetus.

Live with your position Themis, my belief is otherwise.

[_Jersey Girl]

You wrote "...Why are you giving me a choice between the feelings vs the life of a person? Are you implying that both can't be equally important?..."

If they are equally important to you, and when one chooses an abortion becasue of feelings,you appear to support that choice. And I can only assume that those feelings would be hurt and bad feelings, if I am wrong what kind of feelings are you talking about...I doubt you would mean because of good feelings?

This is not an easy issue to discuss or sort out, I get that...and I know it is not a black and white issue to most when broken down honestly with either position/s.

I don't think that our exchanges are going to be productive in terms of exchange of ideas. I don't think we communicate well.

We haven't discussed the issue of feelings, what type of feelings or why and how they might influence our positions.

I included "feelings" in an earlier post where I demonstrated the typical conservative view that abortion should be permissable in the case of rape.

Why do we make that distinction between rape of the mother and a mother who finds herself faced with an unplanned or unwanted pregnancy, and who wishes to terminate?

Why does a rape victim get a free pass from conservatives and others?

[_Jersey Girl]

Does the new Iowa law provide for women who are victims of rape? I'm going to find out...