No Gay Wedding Cake For You

The Off-Topic forum for anything non-LDS related, such as sports or politics. Rated PG through PG-13.
Post Reply
_Res Ipsa
_Emeritus
Posts: 10274
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:37 pm

No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _Res Ipsa »

Supreme Court has ruled in favor of a Colorado baker who refused to make a wedding cake for a same-sex couple. https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/1 ... 1_j4el.pdf

The holding is pretty narrow. The Court found that the Civil Rights Commission was openly hostile to the baker’s religion, and, as a result, failed to properly consider the baker’s first amendment rights. The court did not decide how to properly resolve the balance between first amendment freedom of religion and the power of government to regulate commerce in a way that provides equal treatment. It held that the commission failed to engage in the required balancing analysis.
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
_Res Ipsa
_Emeritus
Posts: 10274
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:37 pm

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _Res Ipsa »

Having scanned the opinions (majority, 3 concurrences and one dissent), the most interesting issue to me is not the holding itself. It is the attempts to reconcile the Commission’s holding in this case with its holdings in three other cases in which bakers were asked to bake wedding cakes that included anti-gay marriage wording or declaring homosexuality to be a sin. The justices seem to me to be pretty deeply divided on that issue.
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
_DoubtingThomas
_Emeritus
Posts: 4551
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:04 am

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _DoubtingThomas »

Res Ipsa wrote: The justices seem to me to be pretty deeply divided on that issue.

Because the brain of our supreme court justices is made of dog _____. We need scientists as supreme court justices.
_Res Ipsa
_Emeritus
Posts: 10274
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:37 pm

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _Res Ipsa »

DoubtingThomas wrote:
Res Ipsa wrote: The justices seem to me to be pretty deeply divided on that issue.

Because the brain of our supreme court justices is made of dog _____. We need scientists as supreme court justices.

What do you think science tells us about setting the limits of free speech or freedom of religion?
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
_DoubtingThomas
_Emeritus
Posts: 4551
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:04 am

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _DoubtingThomas »

Res Ipsa wrote: What do you think science tells us about setting the limits of free speech or freedom of religion?


It is a very complicated problem, so we need Justices with the critical thinking skills. Scientists usually have a better brain.

"Smart people literally have bigger brain cells than the rest"
https://www.newscientist.com/article/21 ... -the-rest/

I don't have much time right now, but I will come back.
_Res Ipsa
_Emeritus
Posts: 10274
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:37 pm

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _Res Ipsa »

DoubtingThomas wrote:
Res Ipsa wrote: What do you think science tells us about setting the limits of free speech or freedom of religion?


It is a very complicated problem, so we need Justices with the critical thinking skills. Scientists usually have a better brain.

"Smart people literally have bigger brain cells than the rest"
https://www.newscientist.com/article/21 ... -the-rest/

I don't have much time right now, but I will come back.


Sure, take your time. No rush.

At one time, some scientists thought that brain size correlated with intelligence. Why do you trust the speculative statements in this article?

And, even if true, why are you confident that "smart" people will actually make the best legal decisions? See, e.g., Michael Shermer's "Why People Believe Weird Things." How do the brains cells of Notorius RGB stack up against your average scientist?
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
_Doctor Steuss
_Emeritus
Posts: 4597
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:57 pm

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _Doctor Steuss »

DoubtingThomas wrote:It is a very complicated problem, so we need Justices with the critical thinking skills.

Unless I'm mistaken, Critical Reasoning is a required cognate course for majoring in criminal justice, as well as courses in various social sciences.
"Some people never go crazy. What truly horrible lives they must lead." ~Charles Bukowski
_subgenius
_Emeritus
Posts: 13326
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 pm

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _subgenius »

DoubtingThomas wrote:Because the brain of our supreme court justices is made of dog _____. We need scientists as supreme court justices.

and there is the best reason why you will never be making a Supreme Court appointment. Heck, this is even a good reason to believe you still use a sippy cup.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
_subgenius
_Emeritus
Posts: 13326
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 pm

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _subgenius »

DoubtingThomas wrote:
Res Ipsa wrote: What do you think science tells us about setting the limits of free speech or freedom of religion?


It is a very complicated problem, so we need Justices with the critical thinking skills. Scientists usually have a better brain.

"Smart people literally have bigger brain cells than the rest"
https://www.newscientist.com/article/21 ... -the-rest/

I don't have much time right now, but I will come back.

Hey, spoiler alert...scientist does not automatically equal "smart people" or even "smarter" people...... so, yeah, you could easily be a scientist.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
_subgenius
_Emeritus
Posts: 13326
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 pm

Re: No Gay Wedding Cake For You

Post by _subgenius »

Res Ipsa wrote:And, even if true, why are you confident that "smart" people will actually make the best legal decisions?

Maybe you should type slower for DT on this one and, to be sure, ask DT exactly how he thinks a "smart person" is defined?
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
Post Reply