Mormons and Critical Race Theory

[MG 2.0]

Two people who don't know anything recommending the same video shouldn't be a selling point, but I clicked on it anyway. I watched about half.

The interviewer finds himself flat footed a number of times as this video progresses. Almost tone deaf. A lot of that going around nowadays.

Condescending SOB. Oh, and I’m not referring to the interviewer.

Sure, if "tone deaf" means a person can't catch the spirit of a baseless message going viral. The interviewer asked good questions, and couldn't get Christiansen to provide real answers.

The questions were shallow and easily debunked by Christiansen. There were a number of times where the interviewer was basically flummoxed and had to recalibrate to TRY and bring things around to his objective/goal, to little or no avail. It was rather obvious. I felt just a wee bit sorry for him.

Christiansen assures that there are thousands of concerned parents, but he's unable to give specific examples of what the parents are actually concerned about.

Indirectly you’re calling out these hundreds, if not more, parents as being in the same ‘boat’ as the rest of the “deplorables”. Those that obviously know less about the real world than you do. Their opinion doesn’t matter. Those that, in essence, “don’t know anything.” What hubris.

Arrogance abounds among the elite.

He frames the problem in platitudes -- "we've come so far and critical race theory is taking us backwards!"

Which is true.

As I said to Res Ipsa, you have your point of view and the rest of us have ours. See you at the school board meetings and the ballot box.

There might be some things that Atlantic Mike and I might disagree on, but I believe he’s made some valid points on this thread.

Regards,
MG

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Two people who don't know anything recommending the same video shouldn't be a selling point, but I clicked on it anyway. I watched about half.

Condescending SOB. Oh, and I’m not referring to the interviewer.

- Doc

[Gadianton]

Condescending SOB. Oh, and I’m not referring to the interviewer.

I'm surprised you'd say that; figured you would have agreed with me on that one.

The questions were shallow and easily debunked by Christiansen. There were a number of times where the interviewer was basically flummoxed

Provide an example. Just provide the timestamp if you want.

Indirectly you’re calling out these hundreds

So far it's looking like these "hundreds" are an invention of Christiansen.

[MG 2.0]

So far it's looking like these "hundreds" are an invention of Christiansen.

I don’t think he’s lying.

What I do think, however, is that if the hundreds of people…and there may well be thousands…were to make their names known and go public in specificity, as to their personal experiences, the militantly woke folks would lambast them to no end on social media to the point that innocent folks could end up being assaulted or injured physically in real life. The track record of the far left doesn’t do them any credit for taking things calmly and with a reasoned response. They go ballistic. Yes, there are those on the far right that do the same thing.

Knowing this, however, might give pause to those like yourself that think Representative Christiansen should have the names and details to support his stated assertions.

In the meantime, you can call him and those he represents liars…or deplorables. Whichever suits your fancy.

Regards,
MG

[Res Ipsa]

To be fair, he asks for a concrete example of critical race theory being taught in schools and the legislator says he doesn't have a specific example. How the hell can he not have a bunch of them if he's complaining about it??

He mentions that in a West Jordan high school, they are doing something called a "Privilege Walk"

http://doloreshuerta.org/wp-content/upl ... e-walk.pdf

You have the students line up and take steps forward or back depending on the answers to questions like:

1) If English is your first language, take a step forward
2) If you are a white male, take a step forward

Then they spent the rest of the interview debating if teaching about privilege in this way is racist or not. I think it rides the line.

Can you even imagine what it is like for a disadvantaged person to find themselves falling behind in an activity like this? I think approaching curriculum development from the point of view of “A rising tide lifts ALL boats” is going to have a more lasting and positive effect. NO ONE wants to be put in a position where they see themselves falling behind he rest of their classmates in real time.

This whole reparations thing is a fix that’s shallow and unresponsive to the real needs of the disadvantaged. But it damn well helps the white folks feel good about themselves.

Policies and curriculum that lift ALL students is the way to go in my opinion. That’s the whole idea behind he legislative enactments for Utah and Idaho listed on page one of this thread. Let’s not sink ANYONE’S boat. Let’s keep them ALL afloat. There is no reason to start firing cannons at the other boat…unless you’re a pirate looking for some kind of booty or power.

Regards,
MG

I'd suggest that a couple of old white guys CAN'T imagine what it would be like. I read a full lesson plan for the exercise. https://peacelearner.org/2016/03/14/pri ... sson-plan/

It seems to that the exercise, done properly, would lead students to empathize with each other, as well as recognize that privilege comes in all forms. I'd suggest that it would make more sense to talk to students after the exercise rather than invent a parade of horribles.

[Res Ipsa]

So far it's looking like these "hundreds" are an invention of Christiansen.

I don’t think he’s lying.

What I do think, however, is that if the hundreds of people…and there may well be thousands…were to make their names known and go public in specificity, as to their personal experiences, the militantly woke folks would lambast them to no end on social media to the point that innocent folks could end up being assaulted or injured physically in real life. The track record of the far left doesn’t do them any credit for taking things calmly and with a reasoned response. They go ballistic. Yes, there are those on the far right that do the same thing.

Knowing this, however, might give pause to those like yourself that think Representative Christiansen should have the names and details to support his stated assertions.

In the meantime, you can call him and those he represents liars…or deplorables. Whichever suits your fancy.

Regards,
MG

Oooooo. More boogeymen.

[Marcus]

You need to remember that kids, on the whole, are not walking around thinking much about this stuff. So to then immerse them into something and take a non neutral position in curriculum development and delivery CREATES a somewhat artificial problem where there wasn’t one to begin with.

I would disagree that there isn't a problem to begin with in this area. The 10/21 DOJ report on Davis County schools was harrowing in its exposure of consistent, unaddressed, long-term racism, on multiple levels of school administration on down. Whatever it is that kids are or aren't thinking about, it's apparently not leading to less racism.

Sure, as you mentioned, equal treatment of those with different racial/ethnic origins has always been something that humans have had to deal with. There have always been the overlords and the serfs....

Is there some other interpretation of this--besides the obvious-- that you could share with us?

As it stands, that is a stunningly insensitive remark.

[drumdude]

I'd suggest that a couple of old white guys CAN'T imagine what it would be like.

It seems like this is an axiom of critical race theory, rather than something which has been demonstrated with data.

I don't think its a good axiom to build anything with.

[Res Ipsa]

Question: Are the Asians that were excluded more deserving of the spots at Harvard than the students that were accepted? If so, based on what measures? Should academic institutions only use grades and test scores to determine who should be accepted? what about outside activities? Letters of recommendation? Legacy status? Is Harvard better off only accepting the top performing students from private schools that have a history of success at Harvard? I think the issue is, we want fairness, but often times our fairness criteria is biased, and we don't realize it.

I am not tracking your link back to the USSR. critical race theory is akin to communism? I am not sure if I would go there.

I think race shouldn't be considered at all in admissions. Plenty of other metrics could be used, such as socioeconomic status, so that lower income whites and blacks, from single parent inner city or rural households, could have an opportunity to compete with rich kids.

Marxism, specifically, not Communism. To be clear, Critical Race Theory is not identical to Marxism. However Critical Race Theory borrows heavily from Marxist thought - specifically the idea that equality of outcome should be the measure of success against racism, rather than equality of opportunity.

A couple of observations. First, equality of opportunity and equality of outcome aren’t mutually exclusive. Second, equality doesn’t mean identical. Third, outcome is a test of opportunity. The heavily skewed outcome of our judicial system along racial lines is a red flag indicating that the criminal Justice system may not be operating based on equal opportunity. It’s a signal that we should take an open and honest look at the system to make sure it isn’t operating to the disadvantage of black folks. Finally, equal opportunity is one of those platitudes that we tell ourselves but that we don’t take seriously. We don’t even really try to create anything that resembles equal opportunity.

[Res Ipsa]

I'd suggest that a couple of old white guys CAN'T imagine what it would be like.

It seems like this is an axiom of critical race theory, rather than something which has been demonstrated with data.

I don't think its a good axiom to build anything with.

Funny, I think it’s a solid axiom to build understanding. Isn’t it extremely arrogant to just assume you know what it’s like to be someone else? Especially someone whose background and life experiences are very different than your own? The consequences of this axiom are that we should listen to and give credence to others when they tell us what their lived experience is?

And if you actually think it’s just an axiom, then I suggest you do a little digging into the literature on privilege.