And that's not always a bad thing. Just look at all the idiots in Congress who really believe their own bullcrap.
Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
-
- God
- Posts: 2990
- Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2021 6:04 pm
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
"I have the type of (REAL) job where I can choose how to spend my time," says Marcus.
- Res Ipsa
- God
- Posts: 10555
- Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:44 pm
- Location: Playing Rabbits
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
Could be. Having spent my career in the persuasion business, including observing and participating in the legal equivalent of debate, I would never equate the ability to persuade with being right. See also any evolution "debate" and the effectiveness of the Gish Gallop.
he/him
When a Religion is good, I conceive that it will support itself; and when it cannot support itself, and God does not take care to support, so that its Professors are oblig’d to call for the help of the Civil Power, ’tis a Sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one.
Benjamin Franklin
When a Religion is good, I conceive that it will support itself; and when it cannot support itself, and God does not take care to support, so that its Professors are oblig’d to call for the help of the Civil Power, ’tis a Sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one.
Benjamin Franklin
-
- CTR B
- Posts: 154
- Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2022 1:56 am
- Location: Woodshed
- Contact:
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
doubtingthomas wrote: "Technically, no. I don’t even know where I was last night. Or where I am now, or even if I am."
- dan vogel
- CTR A
- Posts: 132
- Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2020 1:37 am
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
So far, you have not responded to what I actually said about those concepts. Nor have you defended their use in historical analysis. I didn't ridicule you personally, only the use of those concepts when writing about history. I gave specific reasons for rejecting Jung's methodology, but you don't seem to want to talk about that. It's not just me, but the academy that rejects your use of those concepts. You understand that, right?DrNickLiterski wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:23 pm
Based on your comments thus far, I have no reason to believe that you personally understand Jung's theories of synchronicity or collective unconscious. You said nothing at all about these theories, other than your brief comments in the podcast, where you simply ridiculed us for mentioning either concept. Such ridicule, of course, is also regarded by many as ad hominem attack.
Ironically, for you to accuse me of ad hominem at this point brings to mind another Jungian concept, i.e., projection.
I have not engaged in ad hominem, but you repeatedly resort to it. On the podcast last night you attempted to psychoanalyze me because I haven't complimented your book enough. You implied there was something wrong with me because my review dwells too much on the negative. What you have written here shows you would rather make a personal attack rather than defend the use of Jungian concepts in historical analysis. You might not like it, but I have a legitimate criticism of the book's methodology, or lack of it.
- Moksha
- God
- Posts: 6901
- Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:13 am
- Location: Koloburbia
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
Ah, you guys are playing right into Freud's hand with that dueling banana schtick. Just sleep on it.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
-
- Nursery
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2022 6:35 pm
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
This is simply not true. You have characterized us as apologists, for starters---only to backtrack when pressed on it, and pretend you were criticizing the book, not the authors (a silly distinction). You have repeatedly insulted our qualifications, scholarly training, etc.
Again, this is simply not true. I did not "attempt to psychoanalyze" you whatsoever. It would be unethical for me to presume to do so, as (a) I am not clinically trained, and (b) I have never met with you in any clinical setting. Nor, for that matter, did I ever suggest you did not compliment our book "enough," as if such a measure could exist. Rather, I pointed out that you had literally nothing positive to say, other than noting that one point was "interesting."
Ironically, your accusation demonstrates the fact that you actually have very little, if any, familiarity with Jungian theory. I pointed out that your overwrought response (seriously---8 hours and counting) was a possible indicator of a psychological complex at work. If you understood even the basics of Jungian theory, you would know that complexes are not "something wrong with" us. Complexes are ubiquitous aspects of the individual personality. We all have them---or as Jung would say, they have us. We all, for example, have a "mother complex," based upon our individual lived experience with our mother figures. For some of us, that takes the shape of a positive mother complex. For others of us, that takes the shape of a negative mother complex. That is not "good" or "bad," it simply is the result of our own individual lived experience. Complexes operate on an unconscious level for all of us. The goal of individuation is to become conscious of our own complexes, and thus be able to bring them into some level of conscious control. Even at that, I did not identify any complex on your part, but rather stated that you may wish to consider such a possibility.
What you have written here shows that you are so committed to "destroying" the book that you will take two minor mentions of Jungian concepts, pretend they represent the entirety of the book's approach, and then condemn them without knowing much of anything about Jung.
-
- God
- Posts: 2259
- Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
Who the fuks certain of their positions? Our positions seem best explained as provisional if you ask me.
“Every one of us is, in the cosmic perspective, precious. If a human disagrees with you, let him live. In a hundred billion galaxies, you will not find another.”
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos
-
- God
- Posts: 5283
- Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 am
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
Are you certain of this?dastardly stem wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 3:49 pmWho the fuks certain of their positions? Our positions seem best explained as provisional if you ask me.
-
- CTR B
- Posts: 154
- Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2022 1:56 am
- Location: Woodshed
- Contact:
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
You sure seem to be.dastardly stem wrote:
Who the fuks certain of their positions? Our positions seem best explained as provisional if you ask me.
-
- God
- Posts: 2259
- Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Re: Vogel on with Backyard Professor Again
I’m pretty iffy, in truth. I like to push ideas here for a good challenge.
“Every one of us is, in the cosmic perspective, precious. If a human disagrees with you, let him live. In a hundred billion galaxies, you will not find another.”
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos