Excellent takedown of Mopologist DNA misinformation

[I Have Questions]

...you too damn lazy?

I have become weary of this.

Regards,
MG

On the other hand, I will never tire of pointing out your laziness. But you can put an end to it, by not being so damn lazy.

[MG 2.0]

I have become weary of this.

Regards,
MG

On the other hand, I will never tire of pointing out your laziness. But you can put an end to it, by not being so damn lazy.

TTOC

[I Have Questions]

Quote something from him that demonstrates he has recognised the implications of the science of DNA studies, but which doesn’t undermine the claims made about the Book of Mormon internally, and by the Church.

I think that you would have to show what claims and/or doctrines are made within the Book of Mormon that support your claims. The church and many of the members that take the time to explore this topic in depth are OK with it. It is the critics that are set in their ways that are not.

Regards,
MG

Quote something (that’s not AI generated remember) from him that demonstrates he has recognised the implications of the science of DNA studies, but which doesn’t undermine the claims made about the Book of Mormon internally, and by the Church. If you can find any, or are you too damn lazy? (Or is TTOC now also a placeholder for “I’m too damn lazy”?)

[Rivendale]

Southerton has addressed this.

• Why do you accept Southerton's scale(s) of Lehite civilization?
• Why would you expect Lehite DNA to "hang around like Neanderthal DNA"?
• If ancient Israelite DNA is genetically close to neighboring populations: Canaanites, Phoenicians, Arameans, etc., what do you mean by "Semitic"?
• Does Southerton's hemispheric theory account for genetic drift, population bottlenecks, and replacement events?

Regards,
MG

Did you read his reasoning? He answered most of those questions. It is the type of DNA studies that have advanced. Autosomal that has far more information than Y-chromosme or mitochondrial which is how we discovered the Neanderthal dna which is in extremely small proportions. Yes he addressed it and encourages the church to update its DNA gospel topics essays to include the advances. You don't see Ugo Perego advocating for this.

[MG 2.0]

• Why do you accept Southerton's scale(s) of Lehite civilization?
• Why would you expect Lehite DNA to "hang around like Neanderthal DNA"?
• If ancient Israelite DNA is genetically close to neighboring populations: Canaanites, Phoenicians, Arameans, etc., what do you mean by "Semitic"?
• Does Southerton's hemispheric theory account for genetic drift, population bottlenecks, and replacement events?

Regards,
MG

Did you read his reasoning? He answered most of those questions. It is the type of DNA studies that have advanced. Autosomal that has far more information than Y-chromosme or mitochondrial which is how we discovered the Neanderthal dna which is in extremely small proportions. Yes he addressed it and encourages the church to update its DNA gospel topics essays to include the advances. You don't see Ugo Perego advocating for this.

Is it true that any implication that Semitic DNA from Lehi’s group should be detectable if it mixed with Native Americans more or less assumes that a hemispheric-scale model is in play? The four questions I asked are still relevant.

Regards,
MG

[Rivendale]

Did you read his reasoning? He answered most of those questions. It is the type of DNA studies that have advanced. Autosomal that has far more information than Y-chromosme or mitochondrial which is how we discovered the Neanderthal dna which is in extremely small proportions. Yes he addressed it and encourages the church to update its DNA gospel topics essays to include the advances. You don't see Ugo Perego advocating for this.

Is it true that any implication that Semitic DNA from Lehi’s group should be detectable if it mixed with Native Americans more or less assumes that a hemispheric-scale model is in play? The four questions I asked are still relevant.

Regards,
MG

Yes it is detectable. Simon responds to all of these questions including the lie he isn't qualified because he is a plant biologist. Neanderthal DNA is in extremely small amounts and we can detect it. Millions of Nephites and Lamanites would be simple to find. And we have nothing. Further reading that debunks all your questions.

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comme ... _fair_and/

[huckelberry]

MG 2.0, Kevin Barney ignores the elephant in the room: Although he and other intellectually bankrupt Mopologists have redefined the Book of Mormon to be a lineage history, not a single apostle or prophet has defined it that way--nor, for that matter, has the Book of Mormon itself.

He has recognized the implications of the science of DNA studies. So has the church. There are examples in the Book of Mormon of lineage groups merging. Mulekites and Nephites under King Mosiah for example. If you hold to the hemispheric model for the Book of Mormon you will, of course, look at Kevin Barney and other LDS folks that have been able to look at things with a more nuanced view as "clowns".

Regards,
MG

I can imagine an apostle thinking should I use lineage history in this talk on the Book of Mormon? Well it's vague; do people understand what it means? No and it is hard to see a faith connection, so better to skip that phrase.

MG, I am not seeing what you are thinking of with Mulekites merging. Why would they not merge being culturally related? I am not catching the relationship to natives in Central America. I do not recall myself ever holding to the hemispheric model so I may simply be missing the specific you are thinking of.

[huckelberry]

Only God is completely true. How can a church be true?

What do you mean by "only God is completely true"? Can you define God? Can you define our relationship to Him? Do you know what, if anything, God expects us to do or would like us to do? Etc.

drumdude's response was sort of shallow and somewhat meaningless, in my opinion.

Regards,
MG

MG after posting the one liner I thought of some clarification so I added some things I believe.

What I added about God caring for all humans and faith being people's respect and love of God and other people does not quite address your questions. I have thought about them in the past enough to think better of thinking that a response to those questions can be more than partial glimpses.

I accept God is love, God is creator, source of all power that exists. In a way to say only God is true is one glimpse of a definition. There are unknowns in any definition of God. Sometimes I have complained that Mormon definitions leave too many unknowns. Sometimes I remember that is a limitation we all have.

In Christ we are all called to be renewed in him.

[drumdude]

MG 2.0, Kevin Barney ignores the elephant in the room: Although he and other intellectually bankrupt Mopologists have redefined the Book of Mormon to be a lineage history, not a single apostle or prophet has defined it that way--nor, for that matter, has the Book of Mormon itself. The book repeatedly talks about promises made to Nephi's "seed" and "the seed of [Nephi's] brethren." This neither implicitly nor explicitly includes anyone else, much less the gentiles surrounding them who aren't even of the House of Israel.

Even in the Doctrine and Covenants we read where people are called to go on missions to this or that place, which is near "the borders of the Nephites," later changed to "the borders of the Lamanites."

So, Kevin Barney and the rest of the Mopologetic clowns have destroyed the Book of Mormon in order to save it.

The promises to the seeds were quite hollow, considering the entire Nephite and Lamanite civilizations were completely exterminated down to the very man, woman, and child. With zero trace of DNA remaining.

It’s quite a feat.

DCP completely ignored your entire point and just focused on the “intellectually bankrupt” part. Which didn’t even mention him.

[Dr. Shades]

DCP completely ignored your entire point and just focused on the “intellectually bankrupt” part. Which didn’t even mention him.

Indeed. Let's take a look:

Although he and other intellectually bankrupt Mopologists have redefined the Book of Mormon to be a lineage history, not a single apostle or prophet has defined it that way--nor, for that matter, has the Book of Mormon itself. . . So, Kevin Barney and the rest of the Mopologetic clowns have destroyed the Book of Mormon in order to save it.

. . . “intellectually bankrupt Mopologists” such as I, . . . have redefined the Book of Mormon. We’ve made it a lineage history, although supposedly not a single apostle or prophet has ever defined it that way — nor, for that matter, has the Book of Mormon itself. Thus, we’ve clumsily destroyed the Book of Mormon in our hopeless and desperate attempt to save it.

Now that I too have been plagiarized by DCP, does that mean I've "arrived?"