Location of Book of Mormon events: evidence from Joseph Smith Papers

[_Daniel Peterson]

The LGT, of course, requires that the identification of that hill as Cumorah was a mistake. Evidently it was the Lord's mistake, not Joseph's. (That, or D&C 128 is just speculation unconfirmed by revelation.)

Why is it a "mistake"?

I see no mistake in the mere act of naming something in a new place with a name already affixed to something in a prior place.

Is it a mistake that there's a Moscow in Idaho and a Cairo in Illinois?

Las Vegas is the Spanish equivalent of al-Riyadh. Is that a mistake?

[_harmony]

I thought LGT allows for two (or more when needed..) Cumorahs ??

No, TAK, it's the UGT, Unlimited Geography Theory, that allows for as many Cumorahs as needed.

Tal came up with that one.

KA

Shoot, KA. I thought I'd see something along the lines of "Of Course there's 2, Silly! LGT is short for Little Grownup Tittybumps."

I'm so disappointed.

[_cinepro]

The LGT, of course, requires that the identification of that hill as Cumorah was a mistake. Evidently it was the Lord's mistake, not Joseph's. (That, or D&C 128 is just speculation unconfirmed by revelation.)

Why is it a "mistake"?

I see no mistake in the mere act of naming something in a new place with a name already affixed to something in a prior place.

Is it a mistake that there's a Moscow in Idaho and a Cairo in Illinois?

Las Vegas is the Spanish equivalent of al-Riyadh. Is that a mistake?

It is a mistake to use the same name for two things without differentiating between the two.

Even George Foreman knows that.

[_KimberlyAnn]

Shoot, KA. I thought I'd see something along the lines of "Of Course there's 2, Silly! LGT is short for Little Grownup Tittybumps."

I'm so disappointed.

I have been on a roll of late, haven't I? I'll get over it soon enough. :)

I hate to disappoint! I'm going to make it up to you, Harm.

I know you don't like to wear bras. I don't really like them, either, but this is specially for you:

LGT=Liberated Gorgeous Titties

Definitely geeky ,

KA

[_Daniel Peterson]

It is a mistake to use the same name for two things without differentiating between the two.

You think that the readership of the Doctrine and Covenants is confused, and doesn't realize that the reference is to a glacial drumlin in upstate New York?

You think that every reference to Cairo, Illinois, needs to stipulate that it's not about the megacity in northeastern Africa?

Decatur, Georgia, is not Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, and so on, ad infinitum.

The last time I drove through Mecca, California, I don't think it specific that we weren't actually in the Hijaz. I hope they've rectified that mistake.

Every time I drive through Manti, I get really confused.

[_harmony]

It is a mistake to use the same name for two things without differentiating between the two.

You think that the readership of the Doctrine and Covenants is confused, and doesn't realize that the reference is to a glacial drumlin in upstate New York?

You think that every reference to Cairo, Illinois, needs to stipulate that it's not about the megacity in northeastern Africa?

Decatur, Georgia, is not Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, which isn't Decatur, Illinois, which isn't Decatur, Georgia, and so on, ad infinitum.

The last time I drove through Mecca, California, I don't think it specific that we weren't actually in the Hijaz. I hope they've rectified that mistake.

Every time I drive through Manti, I get really confused.

Ask a Muslim where is Mecca, and it's highly unlikely he'd answer "in California".

You're reaching, Daniel. Normally exercise is a good thing, but this reach is just lame. When a Mormon reads "Hill Cumorah", they think of New York State. Only apologists with a burning desire to forward the LGT agenda think "Mesoamerica".

[_harmony]

LGT=Liberated Gorgeous Titties

Excellent! Now if we could just convert/recruit a few of those other LGT proponents to the true way, the world would be a much happier place.

[_Daniel Peterson]

Ask a Muslim where is Mecca, and it's highly unlikely he'd answer "in California".

Not the point, harmony.

You're reaching, Daniel. Normally exercise is a good thing, but this reach is just lame.

You're hallucinating, harmony. I haven't reached at all.

When a Mormon reads "Hill Cumorah", they think of New York State.

As in the case cited, they should.

Only apologists with a burning desire to forward the LGT agenda think "Mesoamerica".

When I read that passage in the Doctrine and Covenants, I don't think "Mesoamerica."

Airball!

[_CaliforniaKid]

Daniel,

If I pronounce an archaeological site to be the lost city of Atlantis, and later it is discovered that it is not in fact Atlantis, was I mistaken in assigning that name to it?

If the early Mormons pronounced the site of the discovery of the golden plates to be the Hill Cumorah, and later it is discovered that it is not in fact Cumorah, were they mistaken in assigning that name to it?

The two cases are analogous to each other, but not to the naming of Decatur or Cairo, IL. The crucial difference is intent. The intent of calling the hill in New York "the Hill Cumorah" was to identify it as the famous Book of Mormon location. The intent of calling our archaeological site "Atlantis" is to identify it as the city that inspired the legend. In neither case were these intentions realized. The intention in naming Decatur or Cairo, on the other hand, was to pick a good name for a city. I suppose it could be argued that this intention was frustrated and their choices were mistaken, but that of course requires a subjective judgment that goes beyond the purview of our present discussion.

- Chris

[_ludwigm]

I see no mistake in the mere act of naming something in a new place with a name already affixed to something in a prior place.
Is it a mistake that there's a Moscow in Idaho and a Cairo in Illinois?

It is not a mistake.
It was a stupid american custom in the early times, if anybody listen to an old-fashioned, antique, archaic european.
Names are words by which an entity is designated and distinguished from others.
Different things with the same names can not be distinguished and can make unrecoverable confusion. (See Elias)

Las Vegas is the Spanish equivalent of al-Riyadh. Is that a mistake?

Las Vegas and al-Riyadh are two different city with different names.
And nobody will get confused. I don't think many citizen of Las Vegas knows the meaning of that arabic words. (Sheiks from Riyadh may feel at home in Vegas' casinos.)


There are - or may be - other naming problems. For example the capital of Austria (do not mix up with Australia as Bush did it) is Vienna in english, Wien for the residents and Bécs in hungarian. Most of the citizens know all that names. (You know, there was a certain Austro-Hungarian Empire ) . . .
If somebody doesn't know the more than one name of one object ?
Well, it may be the source of some confusion. (See Jehovah-Elohim)


For me, it may be defined twenty Cumorah in the the four corners of the earth (Isa 11:12), until we see the first curelom-bone dug out. Or the first finding of carved, molted or etched reformed egyptian character, fitting to that caractors we know.