Cognitive Dissonance -- It Sucks

[_the road to hana]

I know some people who really did leave the Church. Walked away. They don't hang around anti-Mormon message boards, they don't whine about how they were deceived. They left.

What do you suppose constitutes the difference between these people and those of you who want to fight and gripe?

Charity, I've said this before.

How do you know they don't post on discussion boards? How do you know what their lives are like intimately?

Do they know that you post on discussion boards?

Trying to speculate on people's own spiritual lives is like trying to speculate on their marriages. When you don't know what goes on inside the person's life, you don't know. You just make assumptions based on what you see on the outside.

Some people are on the Internet; some aren't. Some people quit drinking cold turkey; some need AA. Some people get divorced without incident; some have long drawn out separations. Some people convert to religions practically overnight; others take a long time deciding what is right for them.

You really can't have a one-size-fits-all approach to life, or to leaving a religion or changing religions. And you certainly can't say for certain what goes on inside a person's life without intimately knowing the facts.

Many of those people you think "just left and never looked back" might tell you it wasn't quite that simple. And some of them might even be posting online, and you'd never be the wiser.

[Guest]

So, over the last year I've struggled quite a bit with cog dis. ...

Was this a difficult process for you?

I just want to state again -- it sucks!

Hi Moniker,

I agree. It does suck. And it will continue to suck until you resolve the cod dis. Otherwise, you will develop a pathological coping mechanism (see Charity for a good example of this).

So. The choice is to exercise common sense, or to become crazy. And I'm not kidding.

Which do you want?

I don't wish to be crazy. :)

[_antishock8]

So, over the last year I've struggled quite a bit with cog dis. ...

Was this a difficult process for you?

I just want to state again -- it sucks!

Hi Moniker,

I agree. It does suck. And it will continue to suck until you resolve the cod dis. Otherwise, you will develop a pathological coping mechanism (see Charity for a good example of this).

So. The choice is to exercise common sense, or to become crazy. And I'm not kidding.

Which do you want?

I don't wish to be crazy. :) I feel crazy -- insane, in fact, at times. I am seeking the facts and truth and my attempts are being thwarted... this is maddening in and of itself...

I want the truth -- I fear if I make up an "internal story" to make it fit that this is not adequate. I have a desire to KNOW -- I can't do it on my own. I ask one individual that knows the answers to my questions and this person refuses to answer me. Do I just make myself choose something - even when doubts linger? I don't know -- I've tried -- that doubt creeps back up. Each set of circumstances can be interpreted differently -- often times contradictory. Dealing with a "group think" and "group stories" of others that also at times contradict what I thought I "knew" -- emotional turmoil makes it difficult to sort out too.

Common sense tells me one thing.. yet that doubt just kicks my ass.

Well. If it makes you feel any better I was in the same boat. Born and raised in the cult. Eagle Scout. Perfect seminary attendance. Served a mission to Peru, Lima South 90'-92'. Married in the Bellvue, Washington temple 93'. And I know EXACTLY what you're feeling.

http://www.exmormon.org/bio/mormon_bio022.htm

I wrote that exit story 5/12 years ago, a year after I had my named removed from the Mormon church. I've changed a lot since since then, and yes, it's been for the better. I hope you experience some of the positive changes that I've experienced as you make your way out of this mess. It's hard, but I understand... And so do a lot of others. :)

[Guest]

Well. If it makes you feel any better I was in the same boat. Born and raised in the cult. Eagle Scout. Perfect seminary attendance. Served a mission to Peru, Lima South 90'-92'. Married in the Bellvue, Washington temple 93'. And I know EXACTLY what you're feeling.

http://www.exmormon.org/bio/mormon_bio022.htm

I wrote that exit story 5/12 years ago, a year after I had my named removed from the Mormon church. I've changed a lot since since then, and yes, it's been for the better. I hope you experience some of the positive changes that I've experienced as you make your way out of this mess. It's hard, but I understand... And so do a lot of others. :)

That does make me feel better... I'm going to read your exit story. We're 'bout the same age, too. It's nice to know, at times, when you are struggling that you're not the only one that did so. It helps immensely.

[Sledge]

I know some people who really did leave the Church. Walked away. They don't hang around anti-Mormon message boards, they don't whine about how they were deceived. They left.

So do I. I mentioned this recently...
...they never really cared whether the church is actually 'true' or not. (Either IN or OUT). They just couldn't be bothered to live it.

I know plenty of people like that. And no - I doubt they'd have much interest in hanging around a message board and talk about Mormonism (whether an 'anti' board or otherwise).

You hit the nail right smack on the head with this one.

I have a friend in my ward (yes, I still attend) who has been active (and lives the standards 100%, mind you, he has never even had a sip of alcohol) his whole life. But his emotional commitment to the church is nothing like mine was. This is a man who will eventually be able to walk away from the church without hardly a second thought. We have talked openly and I've told him a few details about church history and he just chuckles and says that he's not surprised, 'cause it never felt right in the first place.

[_Ren]

I don't wish to be crazy. :) I feel crazy -- insane, in fact, at times. I am seeking the facts and truth and my attempts are being thwarted... this is maddening in and of itself...

I 'think' I know what you are referring to here.

At first - when I lost faith - I had a desire for my family, or friends at the church - to admit their own doubt. (I didn't go out seeking it usually, but the desire was there...)
They know about the things I know about - I'm sure of it. But they've come away with a different conclusion - from the same evidence.

But here's the important bit:
In the end, I don't need to hear someone else confirm what I believe to be true. Yes, it's good to talk things through - with perhaps as many people as possible - to get a clear, balanced picture.

But in the end, it only matters what I (or you) believe. Truly believe - in our minds, hearts and guts. That's what we have to carry on with. That's what we have to live with...

[_Ren]

I have a friend in my ward (yes, I still attend) has been active (and lives the standards 100%, mind you, he has never even had a sip of alcohol) his whole life. But his emotional commitment to the church is nothing like mine was. This is a man who will eventually be able to walk away from the church without hardly a second thought.

Yeap - this is a very good point.
We're not just talking about people on 'one side' of the line...

I grew up with a girl in my ward who was very much the same. Attended, but never took it that seriously. And has now drifted away as naturally as a leaf drifts on the wind...

[Guest]

Well. If it makes you feel any better I was in the same boat. Born and raised in the cult. Eagle Scout. Perfect seminary attendance. Served a mission to Peru, Lima South 90'-92'. Married in the Bellvue, Washington temple 93'. And I know EXACTLY what you're feeling.

http://www.exmormon.org/bio/mormon_bio022.htm

I wrote that exit story 5/12 years ago, a year after I had my named removed from the Mormon church. I've changed a lot since since then, and yes, it's been for the better. I hope you experience some of the positive changes that I've experienced as you make your way out of this mess. It's hard, but I understand... And so do a lot of others. :)

This resonates so much with me!

My jaw hit the ground. I actually remembering feeling a little dizzy, I just couldn’t believe that this great man, a man of God, had 36 wives! Thirty-six wives. I was stunned. But the church was true. Thirty-six wives…no, the church is true. But thirty-six wives Lance! I know, I know…I know…but I know it’s true…the church is true. Just don’t think about it. Thirty-six wives. I know I said! Just don’t think about. Put it away. The church is true…

.

[_truth dancer]

I know some people who really did leave the Church. Walked away. They don't hang around anti-Mormon message boards, they don't whine about how they were deceived. They left.

Yes, there are those who leave Scientology and never look back. There are those who leave Scientology and want to discuss it. There are those who leave the FLDS and want to put it all behind them. There are others who try to help those still in the culture. So?

My observation is the less one's life is tied up in Mormonism (or any religion) the easier it is to walk away. The less one embraced the culture the less one wants to talk about it. The less one cares the less one continues to concern themselves. Do you understand this? Then, add to this the various personalities, familial situations, interests, particular concerns, etc, and you have quite a variety of folks interested in their former beliefs.

What do you suppose constitutes the difference between these people and those of you who want to fight and gripe?

See a above. The SAME reasons some former JWs continue to discuss their religion after they leave. The SAME reasons some former Jim Jones followers continue to discuss the religion after they leave. The SAME reasons some Catholics continue to discuss the religion after they leave.

There have been many threads about this. Many posters here have discussed their reasons for participating in discussions involving belief and Mormonism. I do not recall reading even ONE story where a non-believer participated because she/he still deep down believed. I just do not see this at all. If you could site an example or two of this phenomenon, it may be helpful in supporting your assertion. Otherwise it is more of the same... assertions not supported by the facts.

Oh, yes, about faith and hope. I think faith and hope are wonderful for anyone who has hope and faith in SOMETHING. But hope and faith that something will not be true? That sounds like whistling past a graveyyard to me. "Oh, I hope Mormonism isn't true, because then I am in big trouble." That kind of thing.

Oh really? You think faith and hope in Scientology is a good thing? You think faith and hope in the FLDS is a good thing? You think faith and hope in a Islam is a good thing? Faith and hope in a Satanic cult? Faith and hope is science? Paganism? Faith and hope in Hinduism?

Somehow this seems unreasonable coming from you.

My guess is that pretty much everyone here has faith and hope in something.

~dancer~

[Guest]

Whew. Cog dis sucks!