Amore wrote:But many in moderation positions seemed to still have the cult mentality (just new biases) and moderated based on their own subjective beliefs, rather than respecting that people are coming from different, valid, perspectives.
exactly.
exactly exactly.
maybe i exaggerated when i said they told people to go to hell. what they said, and again i paraphrase, is that one's perspectives were too different and therefore invalid or not welcome.
and what it looked like, outside of the moderator forum, is that some people were known enough to say things and it was okay, but not others. and some people were threatening so every morsel of their posts had. to. be. ex. act. ly. com. pli. ant. or. no soup for you!
"Rocks don't speak for themselves" is an unfortunate phrase to use in defense of a book produced by a rock actually 'speaking' for itself... (I have a Question, 5.15.15)
Mayan Elephant wrote:clearly the forum is not for me...
I guess that's the problem with every discussion forum. One size does not fit all.
Mayan Elephant wrote:comparatively, if a company went bankrupt and slammed its doors and gave no notice and took peoples stuff or ideas or contributions and said nothing, we wouldn't be talking about what a great place it was and what great friends we had while pretending all was well on the top layers. we would be calling the place a hell-driven sinkhole that we shared, but still driven to the ground by the managers. that's nom. and it wasn't a one single day event or consequence. this was cooking for damn long time.
Sorry, I don't see it that way at all. As far as most of the participants were aware, NOM was healthy and strong and serving its function very well. And I get the impression from the moderators I have talked to that things were running well when the lights went out. There was no overt discontent or sign of impending collapse. Thayne just let it end. That's all. I'm genuinely sorry that it didn't work out as well for some members, but I think NOM had found a new groove that worked better than ever for a lot of members, possibly because Thayne had lost interest. NOM had stopped being about finding the illusive middle way and had become more about learning deal with the craziness despite NOT being able to find a middle way, more about validating your experience with others and about healing and mending families mangled by church brainwarp.
"Be excellent to each other." - Bill and Ted “The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” - Mark Twain
ME, Yes, you explained my thoughts and experiences. But for a long time, I thought it was just me some of them didn't like. As much as I'm sorry you & others were not treated as well as you'd have liked, I'm glad it wasn't personal towards me.
Awesome that you have long-term friendships with people you relate to. I'm beginning to have that too, little by little. For a while now, I've been very weary of who to trust - between craziness in the TBM and NOM/ex-mo worlds. Genuine, mature people - who respect various perspectives - I trust and I know there were several like that on NOM, and maybe even some on here.
The problem may be we're blunt - not always the sugar coating some need. "Speak nothing but the truth and you'll soon be considered dangerous."
Mayan and Amore, I had my difficulties with particular moderators as well. I REALLY disliked some of how various ones moderated, and fought not to ban some who got banned for "crimes" that I thought were more like self defense or just misunderstandings. So, in a lot of ways, I have to agree that at times the moderation was unfair. But I was one voice and often got out voted. At times I had the choice to publicly support the other moderators or step down as moderator. Apparently like the 12 apostles, we were always supposed to show complete support to each other.
So, I agree that somehow, the moderators need to be moderated.
Perhaps we need a system like for judges, where they have to have a sustaining vote by the board members.
But I tried to stick with the guidelines and objective of NOM, even though I feel that the middle way doesn't really exist. There is keeping quiet and pretending to be a believer, and there is being the silent but unbelieving active spouse, and there is inactive. The only people I ever knew who actually were accepted as an unbelieving spouse were neverMo. For everyone born into the church, unbelief was social suicide.
So, redefining goal of NOM as for those who want to be cafeteria Mormons, those who want to try a middle way (however they define it) or disaffected with a believing spouse or family member, or those who feel culturally Mormon. But I think LDSman's goal of being an active Nonbeliever is something few people can manage. I did it for some 30 years, but was the pretending to be a believer kind. And it made me crazy.
I didn't get any choice in the matter of Thayne being sole owner. It was never up for a vote. I would certainly not recommend it. Dis. As. Ter. Also, all moderators and admin people need to be active posters, or at least reading on a regular basis. The business of the only person who has authority to make new moderators or ban people is missing in action was a big mess. It was really frustrating to have something that needed action and have to hunt Thayne down.
I have no idea what went on behind the scenes. But, I appreciate the work of NOM's mods - whatever it was. The end result, at least for me, was a unique place that I felt comfortable, understood... not alone. That was worth a lot. Being here on MDB is ok, but less moderation makes it more difficult, in my opinion, to keep the replies relevant to the OP.
alas wrote:Another thing that didn't work well, was that Thayne selected new moderators without discussion and voting by current moderators.
Hey alas, I have no idea what took place behind the scenes. I communicated off and on with both Dathon and Thayne and actually felt they both wished I move on... I even understood that.
But, I just have to say that you have my utmost respect. I feel that you stuck around when you would have (maybe?) preferred to move on because you cared so much about NOM and all of the new members who kept coming there searching for help and answers. You truly were a voice of reason and compassion and empathy. You were a long time moderator who didn't leave and I know many appreciate your caring unselfishness.
Last edited by Guest on Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.
alas wrote:Another thing that didn't work well, was that Thayne selected new moderators without discussion and voting by current moderators.
Jesus. And Thayne also refused offers to have the forum backed up with ability to restore the forum archives given to multiple individuals. What a ding dong.
Well. alas. Be glad you are out from under that corporation sole, again.
The biggest issue I had with Thayne was his contempt and disdain for what he called the old guard, including founders of NOM. I suppose too that was my piqued bitch with you and the other mods. How y'all responded to NanaP and Froggie, as an example, was just ugly. I still shake my head. Though, your description of the mandatory public sustaining sounds plausible and explains a lot. It just seems beyond effed up that 12 moderators would act so much Ike the quorum of the twelve in a so-called exmo forum.
"Rocks don't speak for themselves" is an unfortunate phrase to use in defense of a book produced by a rock actually 'speaking' for itself... (I have a Question, 5.15.15)