Tim the Enchanter wrote:According to Family Search, Lorenzo Snow married Sarah Minnie Ephramina Jensen on June 12, 1871. He would have been 57 and she would have been 15 (she was born on October 10, 1855).
Equality wrote:I know it's not pedophilia or anything, but here are some fun facts (that you won't see in any church manual). Lorenzo Snow had seven wives. His youngest wife was 24 when he married her; he was 57. He had a daughter by her when he was 82 years old. That daughter lived to see the bicentennial--that's right, a daughter of Lorenzo Snow (who was born in 1814) lived to 1976.
Holy cow, you're right. She was only 15! I added wrong when I looked at it before. I thought I had remembered that he married a teenager. Their first child wasn't born until she was 19, though, so who knows, maybe he just kept her in a chastity belt until her 18th birthday or something. I wonder why they didn't put anything about this marriage in church manuals about Lorenzo Snow? Surely, the LDS Church is not embarrassed by these facts?
"The Church is authoritarian, tribal, provincial, and founded on a loosely biblical racist frontier sex cult."--Juggler Vain "The LDS church is the Amway of religions. Even with all the soap they sell, they still manage to come away smelling dirty."--Some Schmo
DarkHelmet wrote:Jeffs seems worse to me too, but we don't know all the details of Joseph smith. If he had a tape recorder we might be grossed out by him too. Also, if he married someone, we have to assume he had sex with her. Married people have sex by default, so unless there was a clause in the marriage vows that said no sex would be involved we must assume there was sex.
Since girls start their periods earlier now than they did back then, a 14 or 15 year old girl wasn't as developed sexually as 14 and 14 year olds today. The church has done a good job of trying to make Joseph Smith's polygamy seem normal, but his non-Mormon peers from that time period viewed him the same way we view Warren Jeffs, and they formed mobs that violently harassed him for years, ultimately killing him.
No, we know Joseph Smith did not have sex with all of his wives. There's no evidence he had sex with the older women, for example. So I think it's not illogical to assume that he was restricting his sexual relationships with women who were too young as well as too old.
I've always said the best evidence that Smith wasn't a pedophile is the fact that the vast majority of his wives were obviously sexually mature females. A pedophile would be constantly going after the very young ones, like Jeffs.
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.
Equality wrote: Holy cow, you're right. She was only 15! I added wrong when I looked at it before. I thought I had remembered that he married a teenager. Their first child wasn't born until she was 19, though, so who knows, maybe he just kept her in a chastity belt until her 18th birthday or something. I wonder why they didn't put anything about this marriage in church manuals about Lorenzo Snow? Surely, the LDS Church is not embarrassed by these facts?
If I recall correctly, he married her when he was very sick, staying at her family home. I expect he married her so she would nurse him more than anything else. And, of course, to repay the family for letting him stay there. I mean, after all, their daughter married the prophet!!!
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.
beastie wrote:No, we know Joseph Smith did not have sex with all of his wives. There's no evidence he had sex with the older women, for example. So I think it's not illogical to assume that he was restricting his sexual relationships with women who were too young as well as too old.
I've always said the best evidence that Smith wasn't a pedophile is the fact that the vast majority of his wives were obviously sexually mature females. A pedophile would be constantly going after the very young ones, like Jeffs.
Equality wrote: He had a daughter by her when he was 82 years old. That daughter lived to see the bicentennial--that's right, a daughter of Lorenzo Snow (who was born in 1814) lived to 1976.
How is this physically possible? I mean, really... no Viagra then... so how does a 82 year old man get it up enough to father a child by a 40 year old woman?
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
beastie wrote:No, we know Joseph Smith did not have sex with all of his wives. There's no evidence he had sex with the older women, for example. So I think it's not illogical to assume that he was restricting his sexual relationships with women who were too young as well as too old.
I've always said the best evidence that Smith wasn't a pedophile is the fact that the vast majority of his wives were obviously sexually mature females. A pedophile would be constantly going after the very young ones, like Jeffs.
So Jeffs only went after the young ones?
I didn't say he ONLY went after the young ones, but it's indisputable he did go after young ones.
I don't think anyone knows the exact details of his wives' ages. But we do know, for a fact, he had sex with a 12 year old and a 14 year old.
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.
Equality wrote: He had a daughter by her when he was 82 years old. That daughter lived to see the bicentennial--that's right, a daughter of Lorenzo Snow (who was born in 1814) lived to 1976.
How is this physically possible? I mean, really... no Viagra then... so how does a 82 year old man get it up enough to father a child by a 40 year old woman?
Maybe God sent him a flaming sword.
"The Church is authoritarian, tribal, provincial, and founded on a loosely biblical racist frontier sex cult."--Juggler Vain "The LDS church is the Amway of religions. Even with all the soap they sell, they still manage to come away smelling dirty."--Some Schmo
I don't care what anyone says, there is only one reason to marry a teenage girl. It's not because you are in love with her. It's not because of the stimulating conversation and it's not because an angel commanded you to.