I believe that the sexual affair between Joseph Smith and Fanny Alger occurred in the Year of 1835 when Fanny was 18 Years old.
I really enjoyed the last day of Sunstone, since I was able to attend all day, rather than a session here or there. Don Bradley gave a presentation titled “Dating Fanny Alger”, a bit of a play on words. I remember he gave a funny line to the effect of “By all accounts, she was hot!” Anyway, Bradley tried to pin down when the “affair” happened. Apparently, Emma discovered Joseph and Fanny late at night in the barn. According to Bradley, Alger appeared pregnant. Emma threw a fit, and threw Alger out of the house. (Apparently Alger had been working as a sort of nanny.)
The discovery of the relationship by Emma probably dates to the summer or fall of 1835. Bradley recounted several people who have tried to pin down the date, and noted problems with each date. Some authors have discussed an “embarrassing” incident of polygamy in August 1835. Joseph left for Pontiac, Michigan possibly to avoid embarrassment for his role. On Oct 14, 1835, Joseph describes “dealing with household issues”, possibly a reference to evict Fanny. However, Mark Ashurst-Mcgee suggests this incident refers not to Fanny, but a problem with employees at the printing office.
Fanny left Kirtland in August or Sept 1836, so the incident must have occurred prior to that. Bradley notes that dissenters condemned Joseph on July 24, and Joseph left for Salem, Massachusetts for a treasure trip the next day on July 25. Bradley believes Joseph sent Fanny to Missouri at the same time. William McLellin gave his famous quote about having “no confidence” in church leadership around this time as well. Fanny soon married non-member Solomon Custer after just a 6 week courtship. Bradley believes it may have been a cover of legitimacy if Fanny was indeed pregnant.
Completely unrelated to the OP, but i have had the chance to work with MANY asian immigrants and one of them decided to, when they went in to fill out their immigration paperwork, choose "fanny" as their american name....I was sad....
"your reasoning that children should be experimented upon to justify a political agenda..is tantamount to the Nazi justification for experimenting on human beings."-SUBgenius on gay parents "I've stated over and over again on this forum and fully accept that I'm a bigot..." - ldsfaqs
why me wrote:I see Koresh and Jones as taking their flock with them. Their egos were too big to allow their own deaths to go it alone. The comparison with Joseph Smith is not there.
That's only because Jonathan Dunham ignored Joseph Smith's order to bring the Nauvoo Legion to Carthage and break him out of jail. Had Dunham obeyed it, Smith and his followers probably would've ended up like Koresh and his followers.
Also, where are the davidians and the people's temple today?
The same place the Mormons would've been had Dunham not had the wisdom and presence of mind to disregard Smith's order.
"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"
why me wrote:I see Koresh and Jones as taking their flock with them. Their egos were too big to allow their own deaths to go it alone. The comparison with Joseph Smith is not there.
That's only because Jonathan Dunham ignored Joseph Smith's order to bring the Nauvoo Legion to Carthage and break him out of jail. Had Dunham obeyed it, Smith and his followers probably would've ended up like Koresh and his followers.
I've never heard this before.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
why me wrote:I see Koresh and Jones as taking their flock with them. Their egos were too big to allow their own deaths to go it alone. The comparison with Joseph Smith is not there.
Dr. Shades wrote:That's only because Jonathan Dunham ignored Joseph Smith's order to bring the Nauvoo Legion to Carthage and break him out of jail. Had Dunham obeyed it, Smith and his followers probably would've ended up like Koresh and his followers.
harmony wrote:I've never heard this before.
See Journal of Allen Joseph Stout, 1815-1889 (brother to Hosea Stout)
And while they were in jail, Brother Joseph wrote an official order to Jonathan Dunham to bring the Legion and reserve him from being killed, but Dunham did not let a single man or mortal know that he had received such orders, and we were kept in the city under arms, not knowing but all was well, until the mob came and forced the prison and slew Joseph and Hyrum Smith and wounded John Taylor severely.
See also T.B.H. Stenhouse, Rocky Mountain Saints (New York: D. Appleton and Company, 1873), 164n.
why me wrote:I see Koresh and Jones as taking their flock with them. Their egos were too big to allow their own deaths to go it alone. The comparison with Joseph Smith is not there.
That's only because Jonathan Dunham ignored Joseph Smith's order to bring the Nauvoo Legion to Carthage and break him out of jail. Had Dunham obeyed it, Smith and his followers probably would've ended up like Koresh and his followers.
June 23, 1844 Informed that if he failed to surrender to authorities a mob might attack Nauvoo, Smith abandons his plans to flee west and returns to Nauvoo.
A psychopath would have kept on running. “Come, all ye lovers of liberty, break the oppressor's rod, loose the iron grasp of mobocracy, and bring to condign punishment all those who trample under foot the glorious Constitution and the people's rights. [Drawing his sword, and presenting it to heaven, he said] I call God and angels to witness that I have unsheathed my sword with a firm and unalterable determination that this people shall have their legal rights, and be protected from mob violence, or my blood shall be spilt upon the ground like water, and my body consigned to the silent tomb. While I live, I will never tamely submit to the dominion of cursed mobocracy. I would welcome death rather than submit to this oppression; and it would be sweet, oh, sweet, to rest in the grave rather than submit to this oppression, agitation, annoyance, confusion, and alarm upon alarm, any longer.” (Joseph Smith, the last speech to the Nauvoo Legion History of The Church, Volume 6, Page 500. June 1844.)
Wow...what a great conclusion to a wonderful speech. Of course, many here may have wanted to support mobocracy if they lived at the time of Joseph Smith.
Last edited by Guest on Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
The second evidential stream draws on the first, but adds a new wrinkle. This wrinkle is one of the Hofmann forgeries.[2] Mark Hofmann forged the supposed letter from Joseph to Dunham, and it was published in a collection of Joseph's personal writings before the forgery was discovered.
Despite the fact that the document is a forgery, some authors have continued to use it. For example, D. Michael Quinn used it as evidence as late as 1994, and cites the Jessee transcript of the letter (cited above):
The morning of 27 July, Smith sent an order (in his own handwriting) to Major-General Jonathan Dunham to lead the Nauvoo Legion in a military attack on Carthage "immediately" to free the prisoners. Dunham realized that such an assault by the Nauvoo Legion would result in two blood baths—one in Carthage and another when anti-Mormons (and probably the Illinois militia) retaliated by laying siege to Nauvoo for insurrection. To avoid civil war and the destruction of Nauvoo's population, Dunham refused to obey the order and did not notify Smith of his decision. One of his lieutenants, a former Danite, later complained that Dunham "did not let a single mortal know that he had received such orders."
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
Please indicate in which jurisdiction in the United States a purported marriage between Joseph Smith and anyone else, when he was already married to Emma, would have been legally recognized.
Please indicate in which jurisdiction in the United States a purported marriage between Joseph Smith and anyone else, when he was already married to Emma, would have been legally recognized.
Which is one reason why fanny could marry solomon custer without any hitches. But she was sealed to Joseph Smith to my understanding.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith