The Kingdom of Jesus

[_consiglieri]

I hope not as I don't mean offence.

Zee,
From the wiki-God...


God is most often conceived of as the supernatural creator and overseer of the universe. Theologians have ascribed a variety of attributes to the many different conceptions of God. The most common among these include omniscience (infinite knowledge), omnipotence (unlimited power), omnipresence (present everywhere), omnibenevolence (perfect goodness), divine simplicity, and eternal and necessary existence.

I was just kidding. You and Zeez are two of the most even-headed people here.

I am glad that Mormonism (as I understand it) teaches a god who is not omniscient (contra Bruce R. McConkie) nor omnipotent.

If God were these things, the world itself would be prove positive of his non-existence.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[_Runtu]

By nature, the lion will eat the lamb … and yet one of the main concepts of the New Jerusalem is that it is a Paradisiacal existence, where the lion lays with the lamb. I assume just as miraculous of a human nature change could be expected.

Anything can happen, then.

[_RockSlider]

God is most often conceived of as the supernatural creator and overseer of the universe. Theologians have ascribed a variety of attributes to the many different conceptions of God. The most common among these include omniscience (infinite knowledge), omnipotence (unlimited power), omnipresence (present everywhere), omnibenevolence (perfect goodness), divine simplicity, and eternal and necessary existence.

and the most important: omniHottness

[_just me]

By nature, the lion will eat the lamb … and yet one of the main concepts of the New Jerusalem is that it is a Paradisiacal existence, where the lion lays with the lamb. I assume just as miraculous of a human nature change could be expected.

If such a change is possible why has it not been done already? What is the point of letting humans continue to murder and rape one another if there is a way to make it stop?

Why do some people get to be born and live during this utopian era while others have to live through being raped and tortured and killed?

[_zeezrom]

I hope not as I don't mean offence.

of course not. :)
It is my prophetic duty to proclaim the Gospel of my Benefactress.

Zee,
From the wiki-God...

God is most often conceived of as the supernatural creator and overseer of the universe. Theologians have ascribed a variety of attributes to the many different conceptions of God. The most common among these include omniscience (infinite knowledge), omnipotence (unlimited power), omnipresence (present everywhere), omnibenevolence (perfect goodness), divine simplicity, and eternal and necessary existence.

Respectfully, I would like to point out the bolded part of the above paragraph.

[_Drifting]

I hope not as I don't mean offence.

of course not. :)
It is my prophetic duty to proclaim the Gospel of my Benefactress.

Zee,
From the wiki-God...

God is most often conceived of as the supernatural creator and overseer of the universe. Theologians have ascribed a variety of attributes to the many different conceptions of God. The most common among these include omniscience (infinite knowledge), omnipotence (unlimited power), omnipresence (present everywhere), omnibenevolence (perfect goodness), divine simplicity, and eternal and necessary existence.

Respectfully, I would like to point out the bolded part of the above paragraph.

Point taken.

But of what use is a God that opts to have no more worldy influence than a totem pole?

[_Hoops]

How about addressing my question.

I think the problem with your solution is that there will always be conflict so long as people are involved in the equation.

Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon, and for the rest of our lives.

(I'm on a Casablanca kick today.)

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

I'm not prepared to make that concession. IF folks are born neither good nor evil (which I don't believe, by the way) then a perfectly administered government would have at worst neither good nor ill on the human condition. At best, certainly good.

So given your criticisms, it would seem that you are conceding that people are born evil, which addresses JM's misgivings.

[_Runtu]

I'm not prepared to make that concession. IF folks are born neither good nor evil (which I don't believe, by the way) then a perfectly administered government would have at worst neither good nor ill on the human condition. At best, certainly good.

So given your criticisms, it would seem that you are conceding that people are born evil, which addresses JM's misgivings.

Do you think people are born evil? I guess that is an orthodox Christian position, but it's always a little jarring to hear people say it.

[_Hoops]

Hello JM.

People are born human beings, with all that that entails.

Well, this seems to be the crux of the issue. Just what does it entail.

Setting aside that human beings commit rape, murder, cheat and deceive we have many humans who are born with mental illness. Mental illness can lead people to act out in ways that can be harmful to others in the community.

What makes you assume that people will be born this way? Rockslider has shown that, biblically, there will be a significant change in the nature of creation. But let's assume that there will be mentally challenged people born, wouldn't a perfect, just God be able to address this issue? Is it necessary that we know how that is done? Wouldn't the event, should it occur, invite speculation of all kinds regarding this administration?

Is Jesus going to ensure that there is no mental illness? How will he ensure that human beings over-ride some of their more base behaviors and only "behave themselves?"

Such is the nature of the born again experience.

What about Jesus' administration will be different from the teachings of Christianity?

Because the joyous, over-riding teaching of Christianity is not about behavior, it's about relationship.

I ask because the teachings of Christianity have not made men behave themselves as of yet...and it has been a nearly 2000 year experiment. How will Jesus change reality or humanity?

It sure hasn't. What does this tell us? I'll say it again. Christianity is not about behavior - at least primarily, and specifically initially. Are you then conceding that man can not help but misbehave? I completely agree. Now you're left with addressing your legitimate concern about how The Kingdom of God has arrived.

Now, if peace means freedom from war

I can't agree with that. Peace doesn't just mean removing enmity in a religious sense, it means forming relationships.

then it looks like the Kingdom of Jesus is a fail since it will be established following the biggest war of extermination in the history of the earth.

See above.

War as a tool for peace is a contradiction and can never be so.

In a spiritual sense, I agree. However, war has often resulted in peace between governments.

War does not lead to peace. It never has and it never will.

It often has and will continue.

[_zeezrom]

Point taken.

But of what use is a God that opts to have no more worldy influence than a totem pole?

I'm so glad you asked me that, Drifting!

I would like to suggest the following:

1. Someone to talk to when you are lonely, troubled, depressed, thankful, etc.
2. Peace of mind with the hope of redemption (from the scary God). She is fighting a battle as we speak - for us! For democracy! (This is supposed to sound like Obi Wan from Star Wars #3. Think of a slight British accent)
3. Someone to fantasize about (in a way that any child might fantasize about a mentor)

Can you think of others?