The List

[Some Schmo]

Hey, MAGAs! Do you understand yet they never had your interests in mind?

No, they don't.

They're damned idiots.

[Physics Guy]

In trying to explain why people support Trump, it is indeed hard to believe that stupidity isn't a big factor. Calling it the only factor, however, is contradictory. If Trump's opponents are so much smarter than his supporters, then how did Trump win?

My view of the world is a narrow one; insights into American populist politics from a German ivory tower are probably unreliable. For what it's worth, though, the vibes I get from much of the American left are those of a professor failing to explain something clearly. The plain fact is that the lecturer doesn't actually understand the material, either. They just know what they're supposed to say, not why we should think it is true—maybe not even what it really means. They're not so much smarter than the students after all.

Facing that is embarrassing to the professor, maybe even depressing, and certainly annoying because it implies that they have some hard work to do, to figure out something difficult. It's much easier to blame the students for being stupid, unmotivated, inattentive, and poorly prepared. Blaming the audience is a lot easier than teaching them.

The American left seems to me to be much more correct in its views than the American right, but the left also seems to have spent far too much time scolding its opponents and patting itself on the back, and far too little time persuading and teaching. In that way the two sides seem quite similar.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

… the left also seems to have spent far too much time scolding its opponents and patting itself on the back, and far too little time persuading and teaching.

So, the majority of Americans who voted for Trump are like the board’s conservatives, who are a fairly good cross section of US conservatism.

The next time one of them pops up, I challenge you to engage them in the topic and attempt to demonstrate how leftists should proceed. I also challenge you to stick with the attempt, and don’t give up after a couple of posts.

ETA: This is your challenge:

[Physics Guy]

It’s not my country. I’m working on learning how to talk to AFD supporters, or maybe Alberta separatists. Those folks are foreign enough to me; adding general American weirdness on top is too much. I’m not going to be able to help.

The problem has grown over decades. Half the country seems to be sure the other half is deluded, so by now it’s hard to get anyone to listen, on either side. It’s asymmetrical in that in one direction it’s literally hard to get people to listen to the world not being flat, but if you’re surrounded by flat-earthers then sheesh, at least try to learn how they think.

The only effective strategies I can see rely on finding some common ground. That could happen locally, with people in similar circumstances sharing experiences. Or it could happen nationally if there were some big issue that became important to everyone, like an economic depression or a nasty war.

[huckelberry]

It’s not my country. I’m working on learning how to talk to AFD supporters, or maybe Alberta separatists. Those folks are foreign enough to me; adding general American weirdness on top is too much. I’m not going to be able to help.

The problem has grown over decades. Half the country seems to be sure the other half is deluded, so by now it’s hard to get anyone to listen, on either side. It’s asymmetrical in that in one direction it’s literally hard to get people to listen to the world not being flat, but if you’re surrounded by flat-earthers then sheesh, at least try to learn how they think.

The only effective strategies I can see rely on finding some common ground. That could happen locally, with people in similar circumstances sharing experiences. Or it could happen nationally if there were some big issue that became important to everyone, like an economic depression or a nasty war.

Physics Guy, perhaps it is sad to be as little informed about a country 300 miles north of me. I have no idea what AFD supporters could refer to. I though it was the French speaking folks who sometimes aimed separatist. Alberta? How and why would folks there be separtatist?
In the US many folks have been taught all their lives that Democrates are socialist aim to destroy our freedom preparing for a one world government control system .

I suppose if more people on the edge of this world view move away from it people deeper in might allow themselves to try different thoughts.

[Some Schmo]

The next time one of them pops up, I challenge you to engage them in the topic...

I refuse to engage morons. They have nothing to offer and life is way too short.

ETA: in my opinion, if you ever voted for Trump, you are irredeemable and unworthy of anyone's concern. You're simply not worth good people's time.

[Jersey Girl]

There's none left to even try to engage unless you count Ajax who is the biggest troll going and the others who were here refused to engage. It was and remains a wasted effort.

[Res Ipsa]

It’s not my country. I’m working on learning how to talk to AFD supporters, or maybe Alberta separatists. Those folks are foreign enough to me; adding general American weirdness on top is too much. I’m not going to be able to help.

The problem has grown over decades. Half the country seems to be sure the other half is deluded, so by now it’s hard to get anyone to listen, on either side. It’s asymmetrical in that in one direction it’s literally hard to get people to listen to the world not being flat, but if you’re surrounded by flat-earthers then sheesh, at least try to learn how they think.

The only effective strategies I can see rely on finding some common ground. That could happen locally, with people in similar circumstances sharing experiences. Or it could happen nationally if there were some big issue that became important to everyone, like an economic depression or a nasty war.

Physics Guy, perhaps it is sad to be as little informed about a country 300 miles north of me. I have no idea what AFD supporters could refer to. I though it was the French speaking folks who sometimes aimed separatist. Alberta? How and why would folks there be separtatist?
In the US many folks have been taught all their lives that Democrates are socialist aim to destroy our freedom preparing for a one world government control system .

I suppose if more people on the edge of this world view move away from it people deeper in might allow themselves to try different thoughts.

AfD is the far right-wing extremist party in Germany that the Trump regime supports. Alberta has had an astro-turfed separatist movement for decades, which recent reporting shows is backed financially by the US and Russia. Alberta may hold a referendum on separating from Canada this year, although there is a legal challenge by native peoples. It's mainly about oil.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Trump is attempting to create a taxpayer-financed slush fund to funnel money to his allies and supporters as a “settlement” with regard to his hopelessly corrupt lawsuit against the IRS.

Hey MAGA board members, do you understand that kind of thing is literally what our founding fathers warned against? Are you ok with destroying the constitution and the America you enjoyed for the entirety of your lives?

[Chap]

Hey MAGA board members, do you understand that kind of thing is literally what our founding fathers warned against? Are you ok with destroying the constitution and the America you enjoyed for the entirety of your lives?

After prolonged remote sensing analysis of the brains of many MAGA supporters, I can answer as follows to both questions on their behalfs:

"YES!!! So long as it causes pain and distress to the kinds of people we hate. Have you not been listening?"