WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

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Markk
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Markk »

Morley: Ah, so perhaps vilified, but where’s the first and most essential part of the pair? How have you, Tucker, and Cooper been misunderstood? What are you and Cooper trying to say that nobody is understanding?
Lol, come on Morley...this is another one you have to walk back. This has been a thread full of others vilifying Cooper, by you and others, and you just say "perhaps, but ...?" I guess all I can say is "whatever" to that.

In regard being misunderstood, have you watched or listened to a Cooper podcast? Keep in mind the Tucker clips were of a Tucker interview, and not a Cooper history podcast.

Right or wrong, what is Cooper's style and his intent in his podcasts? You may not like his opinions, and his style and intent, but what is that style. My point here is that having listened to some of his podcasts, I do not believe one can understand him, unless they know him in regard to his style.

One key thing I have said here, that you apparently do not understand is what Cooper's style and intention in is podcast is. As an example in one of his podcasts about WW2, that would be taken as he being a "Nazi" apologetic by some.... he talks about the horrors of war against the average German citizen in WW2.

About 16 year old girls, who were 11 when then war started in rural Germany or surrounding countries, that were for no other reason than for being German, raped 5 times a day by Russian or Czech soldiers, often until they are dead, or why their fathers watched, or their mothers being raped along with them.

He talks about Britain and the US fire bombing urban areas with no real military value, where hundreds of thousands of elderly, women, and children died , some basically melted in boiled asphalt from the streets melting from the heat. And how these folks bought into the lies of the Nazi party, meaning they did not have the hind sights that you and I now have.

How he talks about why the Russian soldiers raped and murdered these citizens, because the Nazis and German armies went through Russia butchering their women and children and decimating millions of people. And why Britain did fire bomb those cites, given the threats they endured and felt by the Nazis.

He does the same thing, in regard to Palestinians, West Virginia Coal Miners, Jones town folks ( from sound bites on that one, I haven't listened to it yet)....etc on different topics,

I personally don't agree with some of his reconstruction, and I have a very hard time listening to the things human beings are capable of, but I also gather from his podcasts that we far too often have our history tied up in nice little bows, that Cooper unties and shows history from the perspectives from people that are often over looked in most historical accounts, and listen carefully, "how they got there." How did a 16 year old girl, being raped five times a day in rural 1945 farmhouse in Germany, find herself in that position.

More when I get a chance.
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Morley »

This was my post:
Morley wrote:
Tue Jul 15, 2025 6:57 pm
Markk can correct me if I'm wrong, but don't think he believes being a historian requires any special training, experience, or education. He probably feels the same way about most of the humanities, the arts, and the social sciences. This is in contrast to jobs like bridge building, chemistry, and construction supervisor.
Your reply was this:
Markk wrote:
Thu Jul 17, 2025 3:25 am
I have to be selective, I only have so much time here. And, I addressed this some time ago to you.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=407acHQpzR4&t=3s

And again, in my opinion, lazy history is bad history.

Was this addressed to me, or someone else?

I tell you what, pick just about any historical topic, and I will find a historian with a degree that has written about it that is a complete moron, in someone's view. It works both ways.
From what I can tell, your link is to an hour-long podcast on a coal mining strike in Ajax's home state. It has nothing to do with what I said. This isn't the first time you've done this. Nor is it the second, third, fourth, or tenth

I'm gong to take my cue from Chap, and follow his lead from a couple of days ago.
Chap wrote:
Wed Jul 16, 2025 1:32 pm
No, I did not say that, as anyone who reads my post can see.

I did my best to give your question a thoughtful and helpful answer, but you seem to be in 'output only' mode. On balance, I don't think it is worth my while spending any more time on you.
I'm outa here, Markk.
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Jersey Girl
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Jersey Girl »

Morley wrote:
Thu Jul 17, 2025 11:36 pm
This was my post:
Morley wrote:
Tue Jul 15, 2025 6:57 pm
Markk can correct me if I'm wrong, but don't think he believes being a historian requires any special training, experience, or education. He probably feels the same way about most of the humanities, the arts, and the social sciences. This is in contrast to jobs like bridge building, chemistry, and construction supervisor.
Your reply was this:
Markk wrote:
Thu Jul 17, 2025 3:25 am
I have to be selective, I only have so much time here. And, I addressed this some time ago to you.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=407acHQpzR4&t=3s

And again, in my opinion, lazy history is bad history.

Was this addressed to me, or someone else?

I tell you what, pick just about any historical topic, and I will find a historian with a degree that has written about it that is a complete moron, in someone's view. It works both ways.
From what I can tell, your link is to an hour-long podcast on a coal mining strike in Ajax's home state. It has nothing to do with what I said. This isn't the first time you've done this. Nor is it the second, third, fourth, or tenth

I'm gong to take my cue from Chap, and follow his lead from a couple of days ago.
Chap wrote:
Wed Jul 16, 2025 1:32 pm
No, I did not say that, as anyone who reads my post can see.

I did my best to give your question a thoughtful and helpful answer, but you seem to be in 'output only' mode. On balance, I don't think it is worth my while spending any more time on you.
I'm outa here, Markk.
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Gadianton
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

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Have you listened to a Cooper podcast? Which one?
What does that have to do anything I said, except for the fact that podcasts are unlikely to be historical monographs? Which podcast of his is your favorite? Can you provide a list of all the sources he used and trace back all his comments to those sources? I'm not aware of a historian proper who has exclusively traded in podcasts, it doesn't make a lot of sense.

You should really drop your insistence that he's a historian, it's ridiculous. There are science YouTubers who I think put out some good stuff but aren't necessarily scientists themselves and they don't claim to be. There's no shame in that. The fact that he's a history popularizer and not a distinguished historian is not a big deal in itself, except for when his followers inflate his credentials. Why die on that hill?
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Markk
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Markk »

Morley I'm outa here, Markk.
That is such a cop out.

One key thing that came out of this thread is that Cooper was vilified by many here, with a lot of negative judgement, on two paragraphs of what he said in a podcast interview, and from what I can determine, not one of you have listened to on of his podcasts.

It appears that it in nothing more than identity hate based on identity politics of hate. Some Democratic congress folks signed a statement that Cooper was a Holocaust denier and Nazi Apologist, and other left leaning sources stated he is anti semantic, as those Congress persons imply. Again, and you have not even listened to one of his podcasts.

You don't have to listen to this whole podcast, it is over 20 hours....or any of it, but I challenge you to listen to the first 25 minutes, or at least the first 10 minutes of this podcast in regard to those allegations.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-tAltA ... cT&index=6
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Markk »

Gadianton wrote:
Fri Jul 18, 2025 12:36 am
Have you listened to a Cooper podcast? Which one?
What does that have to do anything I said, except for the fact that podcasts are unlikely to be historical monographs? Which podcast of his is your favorite? Can you provide a list of all the sources he used and trace back all his comments to those sources? I'm not aware of a historian proper who has exclusively traded in podcasts, it doesn't make a lot of sense.

You should really drop your insistence that he's a historian, it's ridiculous. There are science YouTubers who I think put out some good stuff but aren't necessarily scientists themselves and they don't claim to be. There's no shame in that. The fact that he's a history popularizer and not a distinguished historian is not a big deal in itself, except for when his followers inflate his credentials. Why die on that hill?
Lol, well yes, there are historical documentaries and historical podcasts, and it is the future of learning more and more. We will have to see how AI impacts that. What it has to do with "anything"....it is just so telling of how you criticize what you haven't even experienced or tested.

Many of his podcast are very exhaustive, over 20 hours, so in that regard they are well researched, well produced, and very informative and one can learn a lot of history from them.
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Marcus »

Markk wrote:
Fri Jul 18, 2025 1:31 am
... historical documenteries and historical podcasts, and it is the future of learning more and more...
No, it's not. It's the way uneducated people are entranced by the flashy stuff, but NO. And let me be even more specific, that's a HARD NO. It is NOT "the future of learning". You only think that because you can't figure out what it takes to be a historian, and you're swayed by the charisma of a charlatan.
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Gadianton
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

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Lol, well yes, there are historical documentaries and historical podcasts, and it is the future of learning more and more. We will have to see how A.I. impacts that. What it has to do with "anything"....it is just so telling of how you criticize what you haven't even experienced or tested.
The issue of this particular aside isn't whether it's a "historical" podcast or a "science" podcast, but whether the podcaster is a scientist or a historian. You're conflating the genre of the output and the credentials of the producer on purpose. Listening to his podcasts won't help answer the question of whether he's a historian. If you change your point to be; Gad, you can't say you don't agree with him if you've never listened to his podcasts, then that would be a much better point. My response to that would be, I listened to him for at least 20 minutes on Tucker and I wasn't impressed. I did research his output, after you brought him up as a historian, to see if there is any educational background, productions, or acclaim that could qualify him as a historian and nope, nothing.
Many of his podcast are very exhaustive, over 20 hours, so in that regard they are well researched, well produced, and very informative and one can learn a lot of history from them.
Even if that's true, it doesn't make him a historian. If I make 20 hours of exhaustive podcasts on quantum mechanics that physics guy greenlights as okay, it won't make me a physicist.
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Gadianton
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Gadianton »

Marcus wrote:And let me be even more specific, that's a HARD NO. It is NOT "the future of learning". You only think that because you can't figure out what it takes to be a historian, and you're swayed by the charisma of a charlatan.
Correct.
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Markk
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Re: WW2 politics, and leading up to the War and beyond...

Post by Markk »

Marcus wrote:
Fri Jul 18, 2025 1:41 am
Markk wrote:
Fri Jul 18, 2025 1:31 am
... historical documenteries and historical podcasts, and it is the future of learning more and more...
No, it's not. It's the way uneducated people are entranced by the flashy stuff, but NO. And let me be even more specific, that's a HARD NO. It is NOT "the future of learning". You only think that because you can't figure out what it takes to be a historian, and you're swayed by the charisma of a charlatan.
People are going to be able to learn more from their PC, staying home, for a fraction of the cost of what a education costs them today. As it develops and documentaries and podcasters improve, learning will adapt with it. It is happing already with online universities and programs, I am not sure what world you are living in. You said you were a professor, when you are walking around campus, take look at the students and how many are on their phones and pads...just as you are reading this on your device. And you forgot the AI part, once that goes all bets are off.

There are some really cool and interesting History podcasts out there, and you can deny that all you want, and good luck to that.

Start here and do your own research, and if you don't think education is heading this way....we can certainly agree to disagree.

https://www.mdpi.com/2227-7102/13/9/898 ... 0discourse.

https://podcast.feedspot.com/higher_education_podcasts/
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