What's a concubine?

[_MishMagnet]

I agree that, generally speaking, men are less inclined towards monogamy than women are. The evolutional urge is to spread the seed far and wide.

I still maintain that if polygamy were God's plan there would be far more women than men and women would be totally fine having no 'real' husband to help out with her real children and wouldn't mind giving her heart to one man who has, in turn, given his to numerous women.

I've yet to see any proof that polygamy is anything but man-made by the selfish and powerful.

[_Runtu]

I'm just about done rereading Compton's book, and what comes back to me over and over is that sense of "sacred loneliness." The wives were pretty much left to themselves by their husbands, Joseph Smith included. It's interesting that they found companionship among sister-wives, whereas their husbands visited them only on occasion. Very rarely did Joseph's wives live with him for very long before Emma threw them out. Later when HCK and BY took Joseph's wives "for time" they were definitely in the lower caste, considered "proxy wives," which in practice meant little more than concubines.

[_truth dancer]

Hi Mishmagnet... :-)

I agree that, generally speaking, men are less inclined towards monogamy than women are. The evolutional urge is to spread the seed far and wide.

Actually the research shows men and women both tend toward pair bonding, (monogamy) and in addition, both men and women, in equal percentages, (about 50%) engage in promiscuous behavior when given equal opportunities.

This research examines virtually every group/tribe/society known to humans (smile).. .throughout the world, and is remarkably consistent.

Men pair bond and look for other women to share their DNA, women pair bond and look for other men to give gifts and help provide. It is an exchange of favors.

Just to clarify a bit... (smile)

I'm with you... the whole "plan" just seems so inconsistent with life, with our species, with kindness, love, care, emotional intimacy, compassion, sexuality, and all that is good in the human.

I hold to the idea of the golden rule... I'm just not seeing Joseph Smith, BY, and other lovers of polygamy get this little teaching.

:-)

Once again Beastie, I am sorry for derailing. :-) I'm going to keep my mouth shut now so you can get responses to your very good question! (smile)

~dancer~

[_Trinity]

Hmmmmm (going to derail for another 30 seconds).

I'm not sure which data you are looking at TD. There may be a cultural imperative for pair bonding, and I might debate even that because of the statistical numbers showing adultery in such high numbers with a disproportionately higher number for males.

I agree with mishmagnet about a biological imperative. I don't have time to look up the stats right now but I recall that in the mammal species the incidence of lifetime monogamy for male/female mating is less than 5%. As a general rule the male is inclined to spread seed with as many females as possible, and the female is inclined to protect the young.

I will try to look it up later.

[_truth dancer]

Hi Trinity... :-)

I'm not sure which data you are looking at TD. There may be a cultural imperative for pair bonding, and I might debate even that because of the statistical numbers showing adultery in such high numbers with a disproportionately higher number for males.

Actually the research is quite consistent on this.

It turns out, given equal opportunities, women "cheat" as much as men... about 50%.

Males and females pair bond. There is really no question about this. Both men and women also cheat... about fifty percent do so.

Yes, about fifty percent of the males of our species "spread their seed" beyond their primary mate, but about fifty percent of females "cheat" to gain favors. Turns out, for some of our ancestors, females did better if they had additional "friends" for extra favors (resourses for themselves and offspring), for protection, (for themselves and offspring), if their primary male was absent, or if their mate found someone else.

It is true that most mammals do not pair bond but humans have adopted the mating traits of many birds for a variety of significant and crucial reasons.

Cross culturally... literally throughout the world, males and females pair bond. Serial monogamy is by far and away the norm, with pairs bonding and mating until offspring reach independence. In the human evolution has determined this age at 4. 5 years. (smile) But this is extraordinarly consistent from the most modern societies to the most remote tribes.

You may want to read, David Buss, The Evolution of Desire, Jared Diamond, Why sex is fun, Robert Wright, The Moral Animal, and Helen Fisher, (my all time favorite anthropologist), The Sex Contract, Why we Love, The Anatomy of Love.

I agree with mishmagnet about a biological imperative. I don't have time to look up the stats right now but I recall that in the mammal species the incidence of lifetime monogamy for male/female mating is less than 5%. As a general rule the male is inclined to spread seed with as many females as possible, and the female is inclined to protect the young.

Again, about 50% of males and females cheat in our species. For different, but very clear and well established reasons.

The reason it may appear differently in some societies is that females (that want to cheat, or with ancestors that embraced this sexual strategy), with little access to additional "friends" are unable to cheat. However, when the opportunities are equal so is the cheating.

:-)

~dancer~