Jacob Hansen: Yesser No?

[I Have Questions]

In what qualitative way(s) has Christianity changed since the time of Jesus?

Most importantly the concept of the Godhead/Trinity and God's characteristics became corrupted into something that didn't resemble the teachings of Jesus as recorded in the Gospels and the writings of Paul and the very early church fathers.

Can you give some examples of Jesus teaching the Godhead/Trinity in the way that Mormonism teaches it?

[MG 2.0]

The kind of church that existed at the time of Christ and after His death was of a different 'kind' (qualitative disposition) than what has come as a result of the restoration.

You are shifting the goalposts. You said that Christianity was qualitatively different to what Jesus taught, hence the need to restore the things that Jesus taught. Now you’re saying that the SLC LDS Church is qualitatively different to what Jesus taught. The amount of flip flops in your arguments is more than in a Havaianas factory. Make your mind up.

I've said what I've said. Take it or leave it. Or ignore it.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Most importantly the concept of the Godhead/Trinity and God's characteristics became corrupted into something that didn't resemble the teachings of Jesus as recorded in the Gospels and the writings of Paul and the very early church fathers.

Can you give some examples of Jesus teaching the Godhead/Trinity in the way that Mormonism teaches it?

Look it up. Lazy bones.

Regards,
MG

[I Have Questions]

Can you give some examples of Jesus teaching the Godhead/Trinity in the way that Mormonism teaches it?

Look it up. Lazy bones.

Regards,
MG

So that’s a no, you can’t. Thought not.

[PseudoPaul]

That’s useful. The context though is that Mormonism restores those things that have radically changed. By teaching atonement and Christ’s divinity, both Christianity in general, and Mormonism specifically, are radically different to what Jesus taught. Which in turn undermines the notion of “restoring something”.

Yeah, that's important. Jesus was Jewish. Christianity starts to develop really as a reaction to Jesus' death. Because Jesus started little pockets of communities in many different towns and didn't set up any kind of central leadership structure, those little pockets evolved in different ways after his death.In the first century you get many different factions of Christianity. Mormonism is not similar at all to any of the first century Christian communities or their belief systems. Neither are any of the major Christian denominations today.

The attempt was certainly to restore "ancient Christianity." But the attempt failed. And there was never just one kind of ancient Christianity to begin with.

[I Have Questions]

The attempt was certainly to restore "ancient Christianity." But the attempt failed. And there was never just one kind of ancient Christianity to begin with.

That’s a very good point. You cannot restore something that never was. Jesus didn’t set up and operate a “church” or a “religion”. He was just an itinerant preacher who espoused some grand principles about loving neighbours and helping the downtrodden. It was a very simple message which gets lost nowadays under all the policies and practices and rituals and ordinances that he simply never got involved with. If only Joseph Smith had restored that.

[MG 2.0]

Look it up. Lazy bones.

Regards,
MG

So that’s a no, you can’t. Thought not.

Always transferring the blame. Take some responsibility for your own learning. Do you have to be spoon-fed? That more than often seems to be the case.

Feed me!

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

That’s useful. The context though is that Mormonism restores those things that have radically changed. By teaching atonement and Christ’s divinity, both Christianity in general, and Mormonism specifically, are radically different to what Jesus taught. Which in turn undermines the notion of “restoring something”.

Yeah, that's important. Jesus was Jewish. Christianity starts to develop really as a reaction to Jesus' death. Because Jesus started little pockets of communities in many different towns and didn't set up any kind of central leadership structure, those little pockets evolved in different ways after his death.In the first century you get many different factions of Christianity. Mormonism is not similar at all to any of the first century Christian communities or their belief systems. Neither are any of the major Christian denominations today.

The attempt was certainly to restore "ancient Christianity." But the attempt failed. And there was never just one kind of ancient Christianity to begin with.

If Christianity in its pure form was to exist on a global level with a central authority...,what would it look like to you today? Pure doctrines, ordinances, teachings, hierarchal structure, Priesthood, etc.

Jesus was baptized, right? The Day of Pentecost, there was an outpouring of the Spirit. What was that? What was the sealing power which was given? Did the apostles/disciples have a special authority/power to cast out demons, etc.? Did Jesus teach that He and the Father were one or separate? Did ancient Christianity practice baptism? Was it necessary?

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

The attempt was certainly to restore "ancient Christianity." But the attempt failed. And there was never just one kind of ancient Christianity to begin with.

That’s a very good point. You cannot restore something that never was. Jesus didn’t set up and operate a “church” or a “religion”. He was just an itinerant preacher who espoused some grand principles about loving neighbours and helping the downtrodden. It was a very simple message which gets lost nowadays under all the policies and practices and rituals and ordinances that he simply never got involved with. If only Joseph Smith had restored that.

Are you sure there was nothing more than that? Was Paul and apostle and representative of Jesus Christ? What did he see on the road to Damascus? What about the church that was organized upon the foundation of apostles and prophets? Did Jesus teach that he was the Son of the Father? What did he mean when he taught that he was the resurrection and the life and that no man comes to the Father except through Him?

Are you going to answer these questions?

Regards,
MG

[sock puppet]

That’s a very good point. You cannot restore something that never was. Jesus didn’t set up and operate a “church” or a “religion”. He was just an itinerant preacher who espoused some grand principles about loving neighbours and helping the downtrodden. It was a very simple message which gets lost nowadays under all the policies and practices and rituals and ordinances that he simply never got involved with. If only Joseph Smith had restored that.

Are you sure there was nothing more than that? Was Paul and apostle and representative of Jesus Christ? What did he see on the road to Damascus? What about the church that was organized upon the foundation of apostles and prophets? Did Jesus teach that he was the Son of the Father? What did he mean when he taught that he was the resurrection and the life and that no man comes to the Father except through Him?

Are you going to answer these questions?

Regards,
MG

After Jesus died, Peter organized a church. Nowhere in the Bible, or even your Book of Mormon, does it purport that Jesus set up a church. If it was so important to Jesus to set up a church, why didn't he do that during his 3 year ministry? Instead he used his time to teach beatitudes, not wasting it on setting up a church.