More LDS Racism on MAD

[_Sam Harris]

With regards to racism in this country I have always said this: We killed Jim Crow, but we're still haunted by his ghost. That is nowhere more apparent than in the TBM LDS faction.

Yeah, I am so completely to blame for lack of integration. Me, my white husband, and our child.

[_Sam Harris]

Look, I think I see Coggins right now!

No, no---this is him:

Hey, I like Gomer Pyle. He's pleasant.

This is Coggins:

[_GoodK]

This is Coggins:

Ah I love Oscar the Grouch, that definitely can't be Coggins... I think Oscar's a lib...

[_Coggins7]

Note to Scratch: the overwhelming majority of racism, properly understood, exists today primarily on the cultural Left, among an unfortunately substantial segment of indigenous American blacks, and a tiny, isolated sub-culture of whites associated with the white identity movement.

I suppose you're the man to properly understand it?

Coggins, you scare me.

So, apparently does John McWhorter, Thomas Sowell, Walter Williams, and Larry Elder, to provide you a introductory smattering of the leading (and, in the case of Sowell and Williams, distinguished) Black intellectuals who understand essentially the same thing.

Both the empirical evidence as well as much of the cultural production of black popular media over the last 30 years or so, as well as the general positions taken by the officially media sanctioned Black civil rights leadership and much of the mainstream Black intellectual class ensconced in the academy, lead one inevitably to this conclusion (as does the grossly disproportionate white on black national violent crime statistics).

The following is indicative of what the modern American Black community faces in extracting itself from its own internal barriers to greater cultural and economic success:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar ... Jan24.html

To be fair, this is a generic sign of the times as well, as such ideas are little different than current mainstream Liberal beliefs regarding 9/11 or the motivations for the present Iraq war.

[_Trevor]

So, apparently does John McWhorter, Thomas Sowell, Walter Williams, and Larry Elder, to provide you a introductory smattering of the leading (and, in the case of Sowell and Williams, distinguished) Black intellectuals who understand essentially the same thing.

No, Coggins, I am sure they understand these things a lot better than you do, and, I dare say, their motives for taking this approach are much different than the smug self-justification and historical amnesia that drives your post here.

[_Coggins7]

So, apparently does John McWhorter, Thomas Sowell, Walter Williams, and Larry Elder, to provide you a introductory smattering of the leading (and, in the case of Sowell and Williams, distinguished) Black intellectuals who understand essentially the same thing.

No, Coggins, I am sure they understand these things a lot better than you do, and, I dare say, their motives for taking this approach are much different than the smug self-justification and historical amnesia that drives your post here.

And perhaps then you could expand upon your thesis here in greater detail, especially regarding what "really" animates the positions taken by these eminent black intellectuals (what you claim you think animates my positions is just another of your standard evasions. Care to actually debate an issue Trevor?).

Have you read any of Sowell's major works on this issue, such as Race and Culture, Black Rednecks and White Liberals, or his essays and articles available at Hoover and in the Hoover Digest?

[_guy sajer]

I honestly do not see anything racist in what you've posted from the MAD board? Maybe I missed it. What I read was dialogue that included the differences between the two beliefs. Why one (in their minds) is better than the other. And the ties each candidate has with his church. I do agree that there are some pretty serious things we need to consider when thinking about Obama being president. A person can't just go to a church for 20 years and not believe in what the pastor is saying, can he? I agree, Obama could have found another Christian church to attend that didn't preach hate. There are a lot of them.

But maybe I see this differently because I like Dr. Peterson. I like Smac as well. I can disagree with them and not take our disagreements personal. They are passionate about their beliefs. They also happen to belong to a church that does do a lot of good things for the needy (and if you want to throw the race card in there, they don't discriminate they help all comers). I'm sure someone else knows more about this than I do. This is what I see from the outside looking in.

RockHeaded

Agreed! I don't see anything remotely racist or untoward in what Dan wrote. I don't necessarily disagree with much of it either. One doesn't necessarily have to agree with everything someone says to find the person, on the whole, worthy or inspirational. It kind of depends on the context and all that. Sure Wright spews garbage and has some wacky beliefs, but is there evidence that this defines him as a person, in terms of behavior and how he actually treats and interacts with others? There's a line out there, and it's fuzzy. (My dad, for example, at times says horribly racist things, but he's never, ever treated blacks anything other than fairly and honorably. On balance, he's still a great man, IMHO.)

I love ya Scratch, but I must admit, I find many of the things you think so significant as much ado about nothing.

I do, however, find it, at the very least, curious why good, moral people like Romney do maintain membership in an overtly sexist organization with a racist heritage, and one for which it has never every owned up to or even suggested that it did anything wrong. I can understand why Romney remains in the Mormon Church, I am less understanding as to why he, and other persons of influence and stature, silently acquiesce to the racist legacy and failure to own up to it, and ongoing institutional sexism, and the ingrained bigotry toward homosexuals. If they, and others like them, actually stood up and demanded accountability, I can guarantee you that Mormon Inc. would pay attention, and not discipline them (can you imagine the PR disaster that would be?). Their failure to stand up makes them at least partly responsible/guilty for past racism and ongoing bigotry.

[Dr. Sunstoned]

I do, however, find it, at the very least, curious why good, moral people like Romney do maintain membership in an overtly sexist organization with a racist heritage, and one for which it has never every owned up to or even suggested that it did anything wrong. I can understand why Romney remains in the Mormon Church, I am less understanding as to why he, and other persons of influence and stature, silently acquiesce to the racist legacy and failure to own up to it, and ongoing institutional sexism, and the ingrained bigotry toward homosexuals. If they, and others like them, actually stood up and demanded accountability, I can guarantee you that Mormon Inc. would pay attention, and not discipline them (can you imagine the PR disaster that would be?). Their failure to stand up makes them at least partly responsible/guilty for past racism and ongoing bigotry.

To the dumpster of history we go...as pointed out earlier. This is what I have called in other posts the "statutory rape of the mind".

[_Coggins7]

With regards to racism in this country I have always said this: We killed Jim Crow, but we're still haunted by his ghost. That is nowhere more apparent than in the TBM LDS faction.

Yeah, I am so completely to blame for lack of integration. Me, my white husband, and our child.

There is gibberish, and there is psychobabble. Then, there is complete and unrefined vacuity. I submit the above as a classic example of the latter.

[_Moniker]

Note to Scratch: the overwhelming majority of racism, properly understood, exists today primarily on the cultural Left, among an unfortunately substantial segment of indigenous American blacks, and a tiny, isolated sub-culture of whites associated with the white identity movement.

I suppose you're the man to properly understand it?

Coggins, you scare me.

So, apparently does John McWhorter, Thomas Sowell, Walter Williams, and Larry Elder, to provide you a introductory smattering of the leading (and, in the case of Sowell and Williams, distinguished) Black intellectuals who understand essentially the same thing.

Right, do you also think they understand what learned helplessness is, Coggins? I bet they do! Do they also recognize that there is anger and where it stems from and that some in leadership positions in the community use this anger to rally the community? Why? 'Cause people that feel powerless seek power even if it is at times opposite their best interests.

Go google learned helplessness, Coggins.

Shoo -- off to learn.