Some thoughts on excommunication

[_Runtu]

One of my closest friends posted this on another board, and I wanted to know what you all thought of it. It has profoundly affected me, as it finally explained a lot about him to me.

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My mother was 26 years old when my father was killed. My parents had converted to the Mormon church shortly after they got married—much to the dismay of both their families. So, there was my mom, a young widow with two little boys (ages 7 and 3) in a small Oklahoma town. There were few members of the church and fewer eligible men. It was 1968 and the oil boom in Oklahoma was over and prospects were bleak, so my mom packed my brother and I into our Ford Galaxy 500 and we moved to the heart of Mormondom—Provo, Utah. My mom hoped to find a worthy LDS man to marry, and maybe get the college degree she had always dreamed of getting.

What my mom had failed to take into account, of course, was that peculiar Mormon doctrine that a woman can only be sealed to one man (unless Joseph thought you were hot). In her grief at my father's premature death, she had made her big mistake: she had our family sealed together in the temple. She was now untouchable. Yes, Provo was full of eligible young Mormon men, but none of them wanted to marry a woman who had already been sealed to someone else. They'd be consigning themselves to ministering angel status if they did. And who the hell wants to marry someone with kids?

My mom, desperate for companionship, did the only thing she could do: she started dating people who were either non-members or jack-mormons. She fell in love with a man who had already been divorced twice. One thing led to another and, in what she described as a moment of weakness, she had sex with him. She was heartbroken and went to the Bishop to confess her sin. The Bishop was appalled, scheduled a Church Court (that's what they called it back then) and excommunicated her. All church contact was cut off. People avoided us or were openly hostile. We might as well have been lepers.

A crushing sense of shame descended on our family. It was hell. Our family became inactive in the church. The ironic thing is that we were still true believers in Mormonism. Our faith went from being a comfort to being a burden.

Eventually, my mom married a kind, but definitely jack-mormon, man. We were happy without the church in our lives. Instead of going to church, we spent our weekends camping, hunting, and fishing. It was three years of bliss. Then my mom got a brain tumor. Six months later she was dead and three months after that my brother, and only sibling, killed himself.

I had been inactive in the church for seven years, but all the church indoctrination that I had received as a child came flooding back. I was the last living member of my family and it was my responsibility to ensure my family's eternal welfare. I sent frantic letters to the First Presidency begging them to re-baptize my mother by proxy and restore her blessings. Months went by before I got a staid, business-like reply from Member Records saying that the matter was under consideration. Months later, I received another letter, even more terse, stating that the re-baptism had been approved and completed. I was ecstatic. But I knew that wasn't enough.

I was 16 years old and instead of thinking about cars, girls, and sports, I was obsessed with completing my family's genealogy and doing the temple work for my dead ancestors. The guilt and shame that I grew up with returned. I was the son of an excommunicated woman and my brother was a suicide. I felt compelled to live a perfect life, go on a mission, and redeem my family name.

Years later, after I had honorably and successfully completed a mission, and after I began to feel that there was something not quite right with the church, I attended a Sunstone symposium. The speaker was an elegant British woman. She was talking about the way the Mormon church treats people in spiritual distress. She said that the church bills itself as a hospital for the soul, but that it kicks out the people who need it the most “for fear of getting blood on the hospital floor.” She was right of course.

The practice of excommunication is about as vile and un-Christlike a thing a church can do. Now that I've figured out the truth about Mormonism and the way cults operate, I know why it is done. It is done to shame, coerce, and threaten the alleged sinner, as well as anyone who might dare to get out of line.

I'm 41 years old now and the church that tore my family to pieces when I was 9 continues to wreak havoc and destruction on my life. I haven't been excommunicated, but the moment I expressed my true feelings to my wife, I was cut off and I seriously doubt that things will ever get better. The only shame I feel now is that I let the Mormon church have so much control over me.

Many people say that the Mormon church is a benign institution that helps families. I disagree.

[_MormonMendacity]

That is so sad. And it seems like a recurring theme if you read the other board.

It sounds like often, just when the person in trouble needs help and healing the most, they are excommunicated.

[_Mercury]

I can directly attest to the literal and emotional pain wrought on those who grow up in Mormonism. My father used my mothers inability to stay Mormon as a weapon.

While I was 9-10 I was told that my mother was not my mother anymore. I was to call my stepmother mom, and I was coaxed into it.

The church is a billy club in the hands of abusive parents. It heightens the ability of the weilder to inflict emotional pain and stress on children as young as 4.

Raising your children in Mormonism is Abuse.

[_rcrocket]

The practice of excommunication is about as vile and un-Christlike a thing a church can do.

Make sure your friend tells St. Paul that when he sees him. Galatians 5:12

Many people say that the Mormon church is a benign institution that helps families. I disagree.

Make sure your friend brings this to Jesus' attention. Matt 10:34-36.

The simple truth of the matter is that the Lord's "Church" cuts off people who are guilty of moral sins, and the consequence is that members of families might be set against each other. There are plenty of fraternal organizations you can join, including "churches" who don't do that. Tell your friend to find security in them and to quit condemning us who follow the Master.

"[H]e that loseth his life for my sake shall find it." Matt 10:40. I don't think that mandate implies that self-indulgence meets the obligation to love God first and our neighbor second.

P

[_Runtu]

The practice of excommunication is about as vile and un-Christlike a thing a church can do.

Make sure your friend tells St. Paul that when he sees him. Galatians 5:12

Many people say that the Mormon church is a benign institution that helps families. I disagree.

Make sure your friend brings this to Jesus' attention. Matt 10:34-36.

The simple truth of the matter is that the Lord's "Church" cuts off people who are guilty of moral sins, and the consequence is that members of families might be set against each other. There are plenty of fraternal organizations you can join, including "churches" who don't do that. Tell your friend to find security in them and to quit condemning us who follow the Master.

P

I'm never sure what to make of these kinds of posts. How anyone can just sneer at others' pain is beyond me.

[_rcrocket]

I'm never sure what to make of these kinds of posts. How anyone can just sneer at others' pain is beyond me.

Let me say, once and for all, that I don't respond and will not respond to your posts. Although I am not the biggest pfan of Pahoran and his rhetoric, the stunt you pulled where you accused him of pushing you closer to the brink of suicide by reason of his rhetoric was the worst of all posts I have ever seen short of those which threaten me personally.

However, I am sneering at no one. I am simply pointing out two essential doctrines of the Church -- you can get excommunicated, and it could hurt your family.

P

[_Runtu]

I'm never sure what to make of these kinds of posts. How anyone can just sneer at others' pain is beyond me.

Let me say, once and for all, that I don't respond and will not respond to your posts. Although I am not the biggest pfan of Pahoran and his rhetoric, the stunt you pulled where you accused him of pushing you closer to the brink of suicide by reason of his rhetoric was the worst of all posts I have ever seen short of those which threaten me personally.

P

I'm sorry you saw it that way. Pahoran and I seem to have resolved that issue. I'm sorry you saw it as a stunt. I was quite serious, and I'm glad we were able to resolve it.

[_MormonMendacity]

The practice of excommunication is about as vile and un-Christlike a thing a church can do.

Make sure your friend tells St. Paul that when he sees him. Galatians 5:12

Many people say that the Mormon church is a benign institution that helps families. I disagree.

Make sure your friend brings this to Jesus' attention. Matt 10:34-36.

The simple truth of the matter is that the Lord's "Church" cuts off people who are guilty of moral sins, and the consequence is that members of families might be set against each other. There are plenty of fraternal organizations you can join, including "churches" who don't do that. Tell your friend to find security in them and to quit condemning us who follow the Master.

"[H]e that loseth his life for my sake shall find it." Matt 10:40. I don't think that mandate implies that self-indulgence meets the obligation to love God first and our neighbor second.

P

You assume the texts are accurate. If they're not then you lose your justification and the poor slobs are tormented for no reason by uncaring theocrats.

Please point this out to Jesus when you see him.

23 And he that looketh upon a woman to lust after her shall deny the faith, and shall not have the Spirit; and if he repents not he shall be cast out.
24 Thou shalt not commit adultery; and he that committeth adultery, and repenteth not, shall be cast out.
25 But he that has committed adultery and repents with all his heart, and forsaketh it, and doeth it no more, thou shalt forgive;
26 But if he doeth it aagain, he shall not be forgiven, but shall be cast out.

Sounds to me like the Church and its leaders are supposed to forgive the first time if the sinner repents.

I think the scriptures are clear on this one and mostly the courts I've sat on ignored me when I brought up these verses, Plutarch.

[_truth dancer]

The whole idea of "cutting" someone off just astounds me, (Paul's ideas not withstanding).

I feel quite certain Jesus would not have ever "cut someone off" for a sin... seems to me he taught the exact opposite. You know, he who is without sin cast the first stone... turn the other cheek... do unto others as you would have them do unto you... inasmuch as ye have done it unto the least of these thy brethren ye have done it unto me, etc. etc. etc.

I just do not see, in the teachings of Jesus anything about cutting someone off because they have sinned.

Seems to me everyone is a "sinner" (if one uses this terminology).

I do understand the idea that a private organization can get rid of whomever they please and so be it, but it certainly is an archaic form of discipline, and an instrument of power, authority, and fear.

~dancer~

[_moksha]

The Mormon process of shunning can be very hard because it means no further help with barn raising will be given. Further, it hurts when one walk out in public and active Mormons all turn their backs to you and exclaim, "K' Plaugh, that one is without honor. He is kvost-vitz!". It further hurts to see one's name listed under the banished section of the Deseret News. It can mean dire consequences in terms of employment and facing the Mormon villagers with their torches at nighttime.