Scamming the Young Women

[_Willy Law]

Oh yeah, Willy Law is a hypocrite?

I am very excited for you to tell me why I am a hypocrite.

[_Willy Law]

Dude, what you imagine as "cultist" and "indoctrination" happens everywhere, in every aspect of life. We are indoctrinated into many things -- through advertising, social pressure, etc.

Why you attack only one of the many social truths of our existence (religion) is beyond my capacity to understand (I set myself up for that one).

But seriously, get a life.

Ok, I know you have equated the church lying to me to my 3rd grade math teacher. What else you got? You going to say the church lying to me and my karate instructor when I was 10 telling me I'm black belt material are the same? Or maybe you are going to try and tell me that the church lying to me is the same thing as my babysitter telling me that if I'm good she will touch my privates when I was 9?
What is beyond my capacity to understand is how you can think any of these bullsh** things are the same thing as a church that is supposedly led by Christ lying to me.
And Simon, get a life? Really? What are you trying to imply? That because I like to waste time on a message board I have no life?

[_Simon Belmont]

Ok, I know you have equated the church lying to me to my 3rd grade math teacher. What else you got? You going to say the church lying to me and my karate instructor when I was 10 telling me I'm black belt material are the same? Or maybe you are going to try and tell me that the church lying to me is the same thing as my babysitter telling me that if I'm good she will touch my privates when I was 9?
What is beyond my capacity to understand is how you can think any of these bullsh** things are the same thing as a church that is supposedly led by Christ lying to me.
And Simon, get a life? Really? What are you trying to imply? That because I like to waste time on a message board I have no life?

Well, for starters, do you honestly think it is productive to hate something so much that you spend inordinate amounts of time posting messages about how much you hate it?

Secondly, only you believe you were lied to. You have no evidence to support that belief. You are merely just clinging onto the hate because you believe that it gives your life meaning. There are other ways to find meaning, Willy. Go outside for a walk or something, enjoy the honesty and beauty of nature.

You weren't lied to, Willy.

[_Molok]

Ok, I know you have equated the church lying to me to my 3rd grade math teacher. What else you got? You going to say the church lying to me and my karate instructor when I was 10 telling me I'm black belt material are the same? Or maybe you are going to try and tell me that the church lying to me is the same thing as my babysitter telling me that if I'm good she will touch my privates when I was 9?
What is beyond my capacity to understand is how you can think any of these bullsh** things are the same thing as a church that is supposedly led by Christ lying to me.
And Simon, get a life? Really? What are you trying to imply? That because I like to waste time on a message board I have no life?

Well, for starters, do you honestly think it is productive to hate something so much that you spend inordinate amounts of time posting messages about how much you hate it?

Secondly, only you believe you were lied to. You have no evidence to support that belief. You are merely just clinging onto the hate because you believe that it gives your life meaning. There are other ways to find meaning, Willy. Go outside for a walk or something, enjoy the honesty and beauty of nature.

You weren't lied to, Willy.

This is some pretty epic trolling you got goin' on right now, Simon.

[_Jersey Girl]

Oh my goodness, take a gander at this.

Simon Belmont

Well, for starters, do you honestly think it is productive to hate something so much that you spend inordinate amounts of time posting messages about how much you hate it?

Willy registered back in April. He has 602 posts.

You registered in August. You have over 1200 posts.

You were sayin'?

[_Willy Law]

I love how you try to imply that I am some unibomber type that has been hunkered down, unshowered, firing off messages since my disaffection a year ago.
You really have no grasp of the anger others feel when they realize that the corporation of the president is nothing but a man made sham.
I get that none of this is new to you. I get that you had family home evenings growing up where you all put your head in a hat and looked at magic rocks. I get that you were told how acceptable it is that God would send an angel with a burning sword to his mouthpiece on earth to coerce a 14 year old into having sex with him. Ok I get it, you somehow make sense of all this and still believe Tommy Monson is a prophet of God.
Let's just agree that I will never in a million years understand how someone can know all this and still believe and you will never in a million years understand how someone can feel lied to after 38 years of going to church.

As for productivity, I would venture to say neither of us is going to win any medals for our time spent on this or other forums. I would say that I can at least claim to be working through a crisis of faith. Facing the lies of the corporation of the president head on and dealing with them is, in fact, being productive in getting me closer to the ever elusive stage 5 and coming to some peace. As for you, on the other hand, what exactly are you "producing" on this board? I mean besides the obvious, being a pain in the ass.

All slamming aside, let me ask you a serious question. I assume since you have thrown your hat in this thread that you are married in the temple. Honestly, I am a guy, I could care less about the wedding. I just wanted it over and get to the hotel. For my wife, and I would assume your wife also, it was a day she looked forward to her entire life. So seriously, in all honesty, was your temple wedding all that your wife dreamed her wedding would be? I mean besides the obvious let downs of marrying a troll....sorry couldn't help myself.

[_Paul Osborne]

We thank thee oh Father for Tommy to guide us in these latter-days!

Tommy the prophet!

Prophesy, Tommy! Say something new. Anything new. Just so long as it's new.

A Mormon prophet to guide the people, for Christ's sake.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5ZEPKC6xHA

Paul O

[_Mephitus]

Wow people. Talk about trolling and thread derail.

Ok, im not a woman (obviously, haha). But heres my take. Even as a member, i knew that it was to be the amalgamated celebrated essense of Mormonism. But it was always a dithering annoyance in my mind that any non-mo friends couldn't attend my wedding. I admitedly always pushed it off that the rewards would outweigh the lack of friends/family. I made mental excuses that even if they where to attend, they wouldn't understand our "peculiarity". Or that anything but the minimalist Mormon temple wedding was grandiose opulence.

Now that im engaged and actively planning my own wedding. It puts things into stark contrast as to what i expect now and what i was expecting as a member. My mother had explained what little she dared of the experience and it always left a funny taste in my mouth. I didn't understand how these seemingly seperated activities could have anything to do with everything i had come to understand in Mormonism. Now with an outside perspective and understanding of the history of the church (the un-whitewashed one) it makes contextual sense where everything came from. And if anything, it makes me sad as i regularly hear stories of this sort from both inside and outside of Mormonism. At best, i merely hear people happy that it occured, not that the experience was memorably happy for the services part.

One thing that put a pin in my baloon was when i attended a non-member wedding of a good friend of mine. He was hardly rich, so their wedding was pretty conservative. But it struck me just how excited i couldn't help but feel. It was fun! I realized i had put all my eggs in the basket for the ceremony. That the vowes you could choose could have so much meaning and power, even without a religious controll on things, it could have such a deep meaning. And that i could celebrate this amazing union with him made it a memory i wont soon forget. I see now that i could never marry someone in a situation where those closest to me couldn't attend and celebrate with me. Because that's what it is! A celebration of love! Not just some spectacle where some words are said, that hold no deep meaning to your understanding, and then (in a dry fassion) you are married.

[_Willy Law]

And that i could celebrate this amazing union with him made it a memory i wont soon forget. I see now that i could never marry someone in a situation where those closest to me couldn't attend and celebrate with me. Because that's what it is! A celebration of love! Not just some spectacle where some words are said, that hold no deep meaning to your understanding, and then (in a dry fassion) you are married.

I was going to comment on why me's use of the word "celebration" to describe a temple marriage.
Sono, I think you are spot on with your statement that a wedding should be a celebration. The church has turned what should be a celebration into an "ordinance". If that is what they want it to be, great, it's their temple they can do anything they want inside. What I object to is building it up to the YW as something that in any way surpasses a traditional wedding.

[_cinepro]

If I understand correctly, back in the day women would traditionally go through the W&A and endowment for their first time on the day they were married! I think my mom did this. Of course, the husband is there during the session as well and fulfills certain roles at the end of the ceremony.

Now that's a lot to process on your wedding day.



Can any old-timers confirm this? I've even heard that some couples still do that on their wedding day.