How do you deal with the real history on Joseph Smith?

[_Stormy Waters]

From Ask Mormon Girl
How do you deal with the real history on Joseph Smith?

This blog post was made in July but I wanted to address to some degree.

But as to the human side of Joseph Smith. . . polygamous relationships with women and girls as young as Fanny Alger, who was, historians believe, fifteen or sixteen when Joseph Smith initiated a relationship with her, without the knowledge of his wife Emma.

Today, I can say that I know Joseph Smith was a complex and flawed human being.

The post bothered me a bit because I don't think she addresses the problems in any meaningful way. She seems to pride herself of learning this information from the sunstone crowd and to some degree her parents. Well that's terrific, but you admit the church didn't teach you these things. So what about everyone else?

Also stating that Joseph is complex and flawed... what does that mean in this context? That God didn't tell Joseph to take Helen Mar Kimball as a wife? That God didn't tell Joseph to deceive his wife? Thing is if these polygamous marriages were of Joseph's own making, he's engaging in the third worst sin according to Mormonism compounded by the fact that he was doing it in God's name.

But it’s up to me to decide how these facts of written history shape my faith practice. A Mormon friend recently gave me a book by Annie Dillard, who quotes the Catholic priest and philosopher Thomas Merton, writing in 1968, a few days after leaving a Buddhist monastery and a few days before his death: “Suddenly there is a point where religion becomes laughable. Then you decide that you are nevertheless religious.”

Nevertheless. For the religious, everything turns on the nevertheless. The word that offers merciful refuge to the human complexity in ourselves and the human complexity in our faith traditions

Nevertheless. I am a religious person. I love a merciful God. And the religious movement Smith founded has given me some of the most intense and meaningful experiences of my life. That wide-open answer is the only way I know how to respond to the emails both hurtful and heartfelt that the legacy of Joseph Smith channels into my inbox.

Nevertheless? That's how you deal with it?

[_Sethbag]

Pointing to God's commandments is how most mopologists defend Joseph Smith, because they know that if Joseph Smith was damned other mens' wives and God didn't command it, that was adultery, and Joseph's prophet claims and mantle is utterly destroyed.

So when someone like Brooks comes along and answers questions about Joseph's polygamy and polyandry with "he was a flawed human being", it makes it sound like she's saying Joseph was doing all this damned due to his own shortcomings, not because God made him do it.

So, Joanna, could Joseph Smith commit adultery with dozens of women and still function as Prophet? Are revelations he received while damned all those other women to be accepted as coming through the Holy Ghost and Joseph's Priesthood power, if he was in fact committed that sin second only to cold-blooded murder, and on an almost industrial scale?

So what is it? Did Joseph “F” all those women because God made him do it? Or did he do it out of his own human weakness? If the latter, was this adultery? If it was, how can Joseph be believed to really have been in such strong communion with God through the Holy Ghost, who we know through Mormon scriptures is offended at the mere thought of inappropriate sexual conduct, much less actual illicit rumpy bumpy with dozens of other women.

This is a good example of why I could never be NOM.

[_Drifting]

And the religious movement Smith founded has given me some of the most intense and meaningful experiences of my life.

This seems to be acknowledging that God didn't have anything to do with it...

[_Dr. Shades]

Today, I can say that I know Joseph Smith was a complex and flawed human being.

I'm sure Jeffery Dahmer was a complex and flawed human being, too. But does that give him a free pass?

[_why me]

The more I know about Joseph Smith, the more I like him. Yes, he was flawed as all human beings are. Why should he be any different. But a guy who only lived to be 38, he accomplished much in that short time. And from 1834 to 1844, in those ten years he 'moved mountains'

[_why me]

Today, I can say that I know Joseph Smith was a complex and flawed human being.

I'm sure Jeffery Dahmer was a complex and flawed human being, too. But does that give him a free pass?

We all have differing degrees of flaws. Joseph's flaws can be compared to Dahmer? Can your flaws be compared to him? Should we give you a free pass?

[_PrickKicker]

Re: How do you deal with the real history on Joseph Smith?

...I can't. (Which is why I am here trying to find strength through others in the same Ark, It is therapy.)

The real history shows from a very young age he was a very good at telling stories, claiming he had supernatural abilities and generally deceiving, good, trusting, honest people in to parting with their money, goods, homes, farms, women and children.

He deserves no more respect than a rogue trader, con man, or sexual predator.

I no longer feel the spirit when I hear this, It makes me want to cry and physically vomit!
That I was deceived so badly.

Oh, how lovely was the morning!
Radiant beamed the sun above.
Bees were humming, sweet birds singing,
Music ringing through the grove,
When within the shady woodland
Joseph sought the God of love. …
Humbly kneeling, sweet appealing—
’Twas the boy’s first uttered prayer—
When the pow’Relief Society of sin assailing
Filled his soul with deep despair;
But undaunted still he trusted
In his Heav’nly Father’s care. …
Suddenly a light descended,
Brighter far than noonday sun,
And a shining glorious pillar
O’er him fell, around him shone,
While appeared two heav’nly beings,
God the Father and the Son. …
“Joseph, this is my Beloved;
Hear him!” Oh, how sweet the word!
Joseph’s humble prayer was answered,
And he listened to the Lord.
Oh, what rapture filled his bosom,
For he saw the living God.
(Hymns, 1985, no. 26)

As described in the hymn, Joseph Smith’s first vocal prayer resulted in a remarkable experience now known by millions of people as the First Vision. It was the first of many visions that the Prophet Joseph Smith received during his short ministry in mortality. It was the first in a series of events that ushered in the dispensation of the fulness of times—a time when there would be a restitution of all things spoken by all of the holy prophets since the world began (see Acts 3:18–21). It was the first of a number of spiritual occurrences that accompanied the restoration of the gospel of Jesus Christ and the establishment of “the only true and living church” (D&C 1:30). It marked the beginning of a worldwide movement destined to roll forth “until it has filled the whole earth” (D&C 65:2).

[_why me]

Re: How do you deal with the real history on Joseph Smith?

...I can't. (Which is why I am here trying to find strength through others in the same Ark, It is therapy.)

The real history shows from a very young age he was a very good at telling stories, claiming he had supernatural abilities and generally deceiving, good, trusting, honest people in to parting with their money, goods, homes, farms, women and children.
.

I would hate to read the biographies of the apostles of Christ before they became apostles. Or Paul's biography before he bacame Paul. Not good.

[_PrickKicker]

I would hate to read the biographies of the apostles of Christ before they became apostles. Or Paul's biography before he bacame Paul. Not good.

The future is just echoes of history. the future is history reversed.

humans seen patterns in chaos and claim divine providence.

God blesses the optimist. Curses the pessimist and Hates the Realist - How just is that?

can there be divine intervention without predestination?

[_Drifting]

The more I know about Joseph Smith, the more I like him. Yes, he was flawed as all human beings are. Why should he be any different. But a guy who only lived to be 38, he accomplished much in that short time. And from 1834 to 1844, in those ten years he 'moved mountains'

What flaws does Warren Jeffs have that Joseph Smith didn't have?