California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

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_Quasimodo
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _Quasimodo »

moksha wrote:In Utah our response is to pray for moisture. Legislative action without attached lobbyist dollars is unheard of and sets a bad precedent.


Lots of praying going on here in California. It doesn't seem to be helping much. At some point I think we are going to have to start sacrificing lambs. I love leg of lamb.
This, or any other post that I have made or will make in the future, is strictly my own opinion and consequently of little or no value.

"Faith is believing something you know ain't true" Twain.
_Quasimodo
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _Quasimodo »

ludwigm wrote:
Quasimodo wrote:I'm pretty sure that climate change is the major factor.
Hey You leftist, liberal, godless, gay, etc. stupid antimormon!

There is no such thing as climate change.
You people, (leftists, liberals, godless', gays, etc.) are stupid. Have no reading comprehension.
And here we see another example of how liberals both lie in the promoters of the lie, and even the peon zombie liberals like the two above don't know how to see the actual truth...
(c) You know who...


I don't feel like my posts have been successful unless someone calls me stupid and a liar. :wink:
This, or any other post that I have made or will make in the future, is strictly my own opinion and consequently of little or no value.

"Faith is believing something you know ain't true" Twain.
_ajax18
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _ajax18 »

Quasimodo wrote:
Brackite wrote:Yes, I am afraid that the drought in California is likely going to get worse before it gets any better. I am wondering how much Climate change is playing a role in making California's drought worse. March recently was another very warm month for California. Barstow, California had an average high of 79.7° for the month of March, which is about 7° above normal there.


I'm pretty sure that climate change is the major factor. I'm also starting to wonder if the predictions about the rate of climate change are too conservative. It seems to be happening at a more rapid pace than some people are predicting.

In California, if this year and next year have lower levels of rainfall, I think we are in big trouble.
Image



Wow, evidence of global climate change in under four years of data.

Do you think population growth might be placing some demands on the water supply that didn't exist before? I know that couldn't be near as big a factor as global climate change, but just wondered if your politics would allow for such a scientific possibility as overpopulation?
And when the confederates saw Jackson standing fearless as a stone wall the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
_Quasimodo
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _Quasimodo »

ajax18 wrote:Wow, evidence of global climate change in under four years of data.

Do you think population growth might be placing some demands on the water supply that didn't exist before? I know that couldn't be near as big a factor as global climate change, but just wondered if your politics would allow for such a scientific possibility as overpopulation?


No. The crisis is caused by the lack of precipitation. It has nothing to do with increased population. You might want to have another look at that illustration.

Image

It's only showing how much snow and rainfall have occurred by March in the last five years.

You might be able to put together a feeble argument that climate change is not caused by human activity (very feeble), but there is no intelligent argument that shows that climate change is not happening.
This, or any other post that I have made or will make in the future, is strictly my own opinion and consequently of little or no value.

"Faith is believing something you know ain't true" Twain.
_honorentheos
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _honorentheos »

Quasimodo wrote:
ajax18 wrote:Wow, evidence of global climate change in under four years of data.

Do you think population growth might be placing some demands on the water supply that didn't exist before? I know that couldn't be near as big a factor as global climate change, but just wondered if your politics would allow for such a scientific possibility as overpopulation?


No. The crisis is caused by the lack of precipitation. It has nothing to do with increased population.

That's not entirely true. While climate change predictions show the southwest growing more and more at risk for long term droughts, population sizes and especially population behavior play a meaningful role in water security. California's unfortunate condition is a combination of all of these factors.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
_ludwigm
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _ludwigm »

ajax18 wrote:Wow ...
Quasimodo wrote:You might be able to put together a feeble argument that climate change is not caused by human activity (very feeble), but there is no intelligent argument that shows that climate change is not happening.
There are monkeys people around, who don't see --- because they don't want to see --- the world we live in.
[#img] http://www.novakeo.com/images/the3monkeys3.jpg[/img]
.



Quasimodo wrote:The crisis is caused by the lack of precipitation.
The lack of?
Or because of?

You are as cryptic as an oracle of Dodona.
Or, I don't understand simple English sentences...

In the vocabulary I use (http://dictzone.com/hungarian-english-d ... ans%C3%A1g ) the synonyms of precipitation:
- foolhardiness [UK: ˈfuːlhɑːdɪnəs] [US: ˈfuːlhɑːrdɪnəs]
- headiness
- impetuosity [UK: ɪmˌpetʃʊˈɒsɪti] [US: ɪmˌpetʃʊˈɒsɪti]
- imprudence adj [UK: ɪmˈpruːdns] [US: ˌɪmˈpruːdəns]
- inconsideration
- indiscretion n [UK: ˌɪndɪˈskreʃən] [US: ˌɪndəˈskreʃən]
- irreflection
- irresponsibility [UK: ˌɪrɪˌspɒnsəˈbɪlɪti] [US: ɪrəˌspɑːnsəˈbɪləti]
- rashness [UK: ˈræʃnəs] [US: ˈræʃnəs]
- recklessness [UK: ˈrekləsnəs] [US: ˈrekləsnəs]
- thoughtlessness [UK: ˈθɔːtləsnəs] [US: ˈθɔːtləsnəs]
- unwariness
- witlessness
- Whenever a poet or preacher, chief or wizard spouts gibberish, the human race spends centuries deciphering the message. - Umberto Eco
- To assert that the earth revolves around the sun is as erroneous as to claim that Jesus was not born of a virgin. - Cardinal Bellarmine at the trial of Galilei
_Quasimodo
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _Quasimodo »

honorentheos wrote:
Quasimodo wrote:
No. The crisis is caused by the lack of precipitation. It has nothing to do with increased population.

That's not entirely true. While climate change predictions show the southwest growing more and more at risk for long term droughts, population sizes and especially population behavior play a meaningful role in water security. California's unfortunate condition is a combination of all of these factors.


Nah, our crisis is due to drought. 80% of the water used in California is consumed by agriculture. The amount of land under irrigation in CA hasn't grown much in many years.

Any increase in urban and suburban populations is of little consequence to the water shortage problem. We just need more precipitation and it's not coming.
This, or any other post that I have made or will make in the future, is strictly my own opinion and consequently of little or no value.

"Faith is believing something you know ain't true" Twain.
_Quasimodo
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Posts: 11784
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:11 am

Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _Quasimodo »

ludwigm wrote:
Quasimodo wrote:The crisis is caused by the lack of precipitation.
The lack of?
Or because of?

You are as cryptic as an oracle of Dodona.
Or, I don't understand simple English sentences...

In the vocabulary I use (http://dictzone.com/hungarian-english-d ... ans%C3%A1g ) the synonyms of precipitation:
- foolhardiness [UK: ˈfuːlhɑːdɪnəs] [US: ˈfuːlhɑːrdɪnəs]
- headiness
- impetuosity [UK: ɪmˌpetʃʊˈɒsɪti] [US: ɪmˌpetʃʊˈɒsɪti]
- imprudence adj [UK: ɪmˈpruːdns] [US: ˌɪmˈpruːdəns]
- inconsideration
- indiscretion n [UK: ˌɪndɪˈskreʃən] [US: ˌɪndəˈskreʃən]
- irreflection
- irresponsibility [UK: ˌɪrɪˌspɒnsəˈbɪlɪti] [US: ɪrəˌspɑːnsəˈbɪləti]
- rashness [UK: ˈræʃnəs] [US: ˈræʃnəs]
- recklessness [UK: ˈrekləsnəs] [US: ˈrekləsnəs]
- thoughtlessness [UK: ˈθɔːtləsnəs] [US: ˈθɔːtləsnəs]
- unwariness
- witlessness


pre·cip·i·ta·tion
prəˌsipəˈtāSH(ə)n/
noun
1.
CHEMISTRY
the action or process of precipitating a substance from a solution.
2.
rain, snow, sleet, or hail that falls to the ground.


Number 2. :biggrin:

By the way, the art of being a good oracle is to be so vague that whatever you say can be interpreted to mean anything.
This, or any other post that I have made or will make in the future, is strictly my own opinion and consequently of little or no value.

"Faith is believing something you know ain't true" Twain.
_honorentheos
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Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 5:17 am

Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _honorentheos »

Quasimodo wrote:No. The crisis is caused by the lack of precipitation. It has nothing to do with increased population.
honorentheos wrote:That's not entirely true. While climate change predictions show the southwest growing more and more at risk for long term droughts, population sizes and especially population behavior play a meaningful role in water security. California's unfortunate condition is a combination of all of these factors.


Nah, our crisis is due to drought. 80% of the water used in California is consumed by agriculture. The amount of land under irrigation in CA hasn't grown much in many years.

Any increase in urban and suburban populations is of little consequence to the water shortage problem. We just need more precipitation and it's not coming.

Drought is certainly the significant factor, but in some ways an inevitable one. It isn't the only factor, and water security isn't accomplished by praying for rain. Or shopping at Whole Foods and raising chickens on one's mini-ranch.

Arizona, where I live and also work on related issues in a very close way, has a similarly high agricultural demand for water. But when urban and suburban residents toss around the idea that water scarcity is a function of factors outside of the space they occupy in the equations, they do damage to the ability to make meaningful impacts to water security improvements. I'd heard recently here in Arizona a water manager discussing California's situation and claim that part of the issue in California was that larger percentages of surface water supplies are tied up by environmental protections than any other demand. I looked it up and it appeared to be true - environmental water demand was listed in the state water resources departments stats at around 50% of the water allocation for the state overall. The point the state data source made about this was that much of this water isn't available for repurposing. But even still, if it were and it becomes a choice of where to send that water and for what purposes, what would you choose to do with it? What is lost by that decision?

The point being, California has poor water security. Sources are tied up and there is little to no redundancies when traditional sources are hit by factors essentially beyond anyone's control. Demand in most counties has gone up over the last 20 years even as per capita use has often decreased. It's an issue involving a lot of factors, including the drought of course, but also population size and location, public behaviors, opportunities for behavior change, and the scale of said changes- all on top of bigger questions that are really going to come down to what Californians are willing to give up, and how well we understand what it means when those opportunities costs have been spent. When you're debating whether or not to replace your turf lawn with more xeric and native-adapted plant material, you're debating the right things in your own behavior model. But it's not particularly better than the person debating whether it matters if they drive a compact or hybrid versus an SUV, eat tons of beef or more sustainable foods, etc., etc., etc. when it comes to the climate change discussion.

Please don't "Nah" that crap again. That's damned ignorant.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
_ludwigm
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Re: California Imposes First-Ever Water Restrictions

Post by _ludwigm »

Quasimodo wrote:By the way, the art of being a good oracle is to be so vague that whatever you say can be interpreted to mean anything.


’Reginam occidere nolite timere bonum est. Si omnes consentiunt ego non contradico.’
- Whenever a poet or preacher, chief or wizard spouts gibberish, the human race spends centuries deciphering the message. - Umberto Eco
- To assert that the earth revolves around the sun is as erroneous as to claim that Jesus was not born of a virgin. - Cardinal Bellarmine at the trial of Galilei
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