So...Trump...

The Off-Topic forum for anything non-LDS related, such as sports or politics. Rated PG through PG-13.
Post Reply
_I have a question
_Emeritus
Posts: 9749
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:01 am

So...Trump...

Post by _I have a question »

Let me be the first to congratulate President Clinton II
“When we are confronted with evidence that challenges our deeply held beliefs we are more likely to reframe the evidence than we are to alter our beliefs. We simply invent new reasons, new justifications, new explanations. Sometimes we ignore the evidence altogether.” (Mathew Syed 'Black Box Thinking')
_subgenius
_Emeritus
Posts: 13326
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 pm

Re: So...Trump...

Post by _subgenius »

For sure, Trump will never survive the pending FBI indictment for his email server and now that this story is out...he'll never recover

"Pulitzer Prize Winning Journalist Exposes Hillary’s Knowledge of Secret Weapons ‘Rat Line’ Which Facilitated Sarin Gas Being Given to Syrian Rebels to Frame Assad

Renowned investigative journalist Seymour Hersh revealed striking evidence the United States — not oft-maligned Syrian President Bashar al-Assad — made possible the chemical weapons attack on civilians in Ghouta, Syria, on August 21, 2013. In fact, though the Obama administration squarely blamed Assad for that use of sarin gas, Hersh — for the first time — implicated Hillary Clinton and shadowy weapons dealings via the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya."


http://thefreethoughtproject.com/missed ... bers-hair/
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
_Maksutov
_Emeritus
Posts: 12480
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 8:19 pm

Re: So...Trump...

Post by _Maksutov »

subgenius wrote:For sure, Trump will never survive the pending FBI indictment for his email server and now that this story is out...he'll never recover

"Pulitzer Prize Winning Journalist Exposes Hillary’s Knowledge of Secret Weapons ‘Rat Line’ Which Facilitated Sarin Gas Being Given to Syrian Rebels to Frame Assad

Renowned investigative journalist Seymour Hersh revealed striking evidence the United States — not oft-maligned Syrian President Bashar al-Assad — made possible the chemical weapons attack on civilians in Ghouta, Syria, on August 21, 2013. In fact, though the Obama administration squarely blamed Assad for that use of sarin gas, Hersh — for the first time — implicated Hillary Clinton and shadowy weapons dealings via the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya."


http://thefreethoughtproject.com/missed ... bers-hair/


I'll need to look into this. Ever read Hersh's Dark Side of Camelot? Interesting book.
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov
_cinepro
_Emeritus
Posts: 4502
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 10:15 pm

Re: So...Trump...

Post by _cinepro »

I predict if Hillary is the nominee, Trump wins. Lesser prediction, he wins in a landslide.

But I won't be voting for Trump under any circumstances (not that it would make much difference, living in CA and all...)
_MeDotOrg
_Emeritus
Posts: 4761
Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: So...Trump...

Post by _MeDotOrg »

First of all, your Post Title:

So...Trump...

...would make a great bumper sticker. Very subtle. Just let the reader fill in the blanks.

Today I read (sorry, can't remember where) a Republican operative who said he couldn't vote for Donald Trump because if he were President during the Cuban Missile Crisis, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
"The great problem of any civilization is how to rejuvenate itself without rebarbarization."
- Will Durant
"We've kept more promises than we've even made"
- Donald Trump
"Of what meaning is the world without mind? The question cannot exist."
- Edwin Land
_honorentheos
_Emeritus
Posts: 11104
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 5:17 am

Re: So...Trump...

Post by _honorentheos »

Maksutov wrote:
subgenius wrote:For sure, Trump will never survive the pending FBI indictment for his email server and now that this story is out...he'll never recover

"Pulitzer Prize Winning Journalist Exposes Hillary’s Knowledge of Secret Weapons ‘Rat Line’ Which Facilitated Sarin Gas Being Given to Syrian Rebels to Frame Assad

Renowned investigative journalist Seymour Hersh revealed striking evidence the United States — not oft-maligned Syrian President Bashar al-Assad — made possible the chemical weapons attack on civilians in Ghouta, Syria, on August 21, 2013. In fact, though the Obama administration squarely blamed Assad for that use of sarin gas, Hersh — for the first time — implicated Hillary Clinton and shadowy weapons dealings via the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya."


http://thefreethoughtproject.com/missed ... bers-hair/


I'll need to look into this. Ever read Hersh's Dark Side of Camelot? Interesting book.

http://www.lrb.co.uk/v36/n08/seymour-m-hersh/the-red-line-and-the-rat-line

ETA: There seems to be a wealth of information in the article and subsequent letters to cover both sides of the arguement for anyone looking for more.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
_canpakes
_Emeritus
Posts: 8541
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:54 am

Re: So...Trump...

Post by _canpakes »

subgenius wrote:"Pulitzer Prize Winning Journalist Exposes Hillary’s Knowledge of Secret Weapons ‘Rat Line’ Which Facilitated Sarin Gas Being Given to Syrian Rebels to Frame Assad

Renowned investigative journalist Seymour Hersh revealed striking evidence the United States — not oft-maligned Syrian President Bashar al-Assad — made possible the chemical weapons attack on civilians in Ghouta, Syria, on August 21, 2013. In fact, though the Obama administration squarely blamed Assad for that use of sarin gas, Hersh — for the first time — implicated Hillary Clinton and shadowy weapons dealings via the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya."


Well, that complicates things. I'm not sure if this is better or worse than indiscriminately nuking the area, as some recent candidates have gleefully proposed.
_honorentheos
_Emeritus
Posts: 11104
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 5:17 am

Re: So...Trump...

Post by _honorentheos »

canpakes wrote:
subgenius wrote:"Pulitzer Prize Winning Journalist Exposes Hillary’s Knowledge of Secret Weapons ‘Rat Line’ Which Facilitated Sarin Gas Being Given to Syrian Rebels to Frame Assad

Renowned investigative journalist Seymour Hersh revealed striking evidence the United States — not oft-maligned Syrian President Bashar al-Assad — made possible the chemical weapons attack on civilians in Ghouta, Syria, on August 21, 2013. In fact, though the Obama administration squarely blamed Assad for that use of sarin gas, Hersh — for the first time — implicated Hillary Clinton and shadowy weapons dealings via the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya."


Well, that complicates things. I'm not sure if this is better or worse than indiscriminately nuking the area, as some recent candidates have gleefully proposed.

From what the actual article says (meaning Hersh's, not the one Subby quoted), it seems that the CIA was using Libya as a source for arms to be sent to Syrian rebels fighting the Assad regime. The sarin gas question seems to be more that rebels in Syria were attempting to make it. Hersh makes a few points that are critical to parsing subgenius' claim. Those being, even if one accepts the story at face value, the Obama administration was reportedly dissuaded from launching an attack on Assad's forces after the Ghouta gas attack by evidence from the British that the gas did not match specific chemical profiles of the ones known to be in the Syrian government's possession. The claim is basically that the CIA-assisted arming of militants in Syria made it possible for the militants willing to use serin to use them to smuggle in needed elements to make the gas. And Hersh argues they used it on their own controlled civilian population to force the US to take on Assad.

That said, the article is followed up by arguments that point out flaws in Hersh's claims.

It's basically something someone who listens to late night conservative radio has probably been salivating over for a couple of years since the original report is from 2014.

So, it's at worst a case of unintended consequences of facilitating the arming of rebel forces fighting Assad (apparently unlikely given...well, an Al Qaeda linked group has been manufacturing sarin gas since 2013? And this is how we heard about it?). Or it's flawed journalism. Subby is just doing what he does.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
Post Reply